TMT3 Build 170

[Jong]

Wow! How come? Have you agreed something with Arcsoft, or were we wrong about the problem? Basically, as the one who asked Arcsoft to fix this should I tell them to stand down (assuming, of course, they were ever standing up!).

 

[Mike5]

James is a magician. Didn't you know?

 

[jmone]

Don't worry. Next ReClock version will work.

Cross post from Arcsoft forum - looking to see if the slight sync issue gets fixed!:

The playback for me is silky smooth - best ever but I've two issues:
1) Audio Sync - Sound is "just" before the video the whole way
2) 90% through a movie, playback died, TMT black screened for 2 mins then returned to the default start up. I could then re-start the movie, and chapter fwd to restart playback just fine.

Any ideas?
Thanks
Nathan

Win7-32 Bit, Realtek Driver, Reclock - TMT set to mix to PCM and output 5.1 over HDMI (not bitstreaming)

 

[James]

Wow! How come? Have you agreed something with Arcsoft, or were we wrong about the problem? Basically, as the one who asked Arcsoft to fix this should I tell them to stand down (assuming, of course, they were ever standing up!).

No, no and yes.

 

[Jong]

Looking forward to testing the new version.

 

[SamuriHL]

Just an FYI for everyone watching this thread. Check out the 1.8.6.4 thread as I've had some really good success with that build and TMT3 170. Bitstreaming of DTS-HD MA and TrueHD passthrough, LPCM excl mode for all bitrates, and a surprise (only tested with one disc so far, but...) that HD DVD TrueHD decoded to PCM and came across into ReClock as 48/24 with the proper channels mapped. My experience has been nothing but positive so far. Give it a try!

 

[thrang]

Just an FYI for everyone watching this thread. Check out the 1.8.6.4 thread as I've had some really good success with that build and TMT3 170. Bitstreaming of DTS-HD MA and TrueHD passthrough, LPCM excl mode for all bitrates, and a surprise (only tested with one disc so far, but...) that HD DVD TrueHD decoded to PCM and came across into ReClock as 48/24 with the proper channels mapped. My experience has been nothing but positive so far. Give it a try!

NG for me - TrueHD on "300" was my first test, and numerous dropouts and moments of short or long static...same, if not worse, than the previous version of Reclock for me...I wish it would work, but this is so damn frustrating...

 

[barco]

Just an FYI for everyone watching this thread. Check out the 1.8.6.4 thread as I've had some really good success with that build and TMT3 170. Bitstreaming of DTS-HD MA and TrueHD passthrough, LPCM excl mode for all bitrates, and a surprise (only tested with one disc so far, but...) that HD DVD TrueHD decoded to PCM and came across into ReClock as 48/24 with the proper channels mapped. My experience has been nothing but positive so far. Give it a try!

I must say I dont really understand what is so good about this? I am today running a Nvidia GT220 where I use 7.1 audio out in TMT (.161) and reclock with exclusive wsapi for PCM and to me it looks like I am getting the full LPCM to my receiver. What is the difference when using .170, a 5xxx card (I have a 5670, but not using it right now) and reclock? I am still not able to get bitsreaming, "only" LPCM, right (I understand that it looks like you are able to get 24bits instead of 16, but any other difference)?

 

[SamuriHL]

I must say I dont really understand what is so good about this? I am today running a Nvidia GT220 where I use 7.1 audio out in TMT (.161) and reclock with exclusive wsapi for PCM and to me it looks like I am getting the full LPCM to my receiver. What is the difference when using .170, a 5xxx card (I have a 5670, but not using it right now) and reclock? I am still not able to get bitsreaming, "only" LPCM, right (I understand that it looks like you are able to get 24bits instead of 16, but any other difference)?

In the setup you quoted, I'm most definitely able to get bitstreaming of TrueHD and DTS-HD MA. Beyond that, all LPCM is sent "as is" to the receiver using exclusive mode...NON-downsampled. That includes PCM decoded from HD DVD and BD. This makes it unnecessary to bitstream at all, and means that non-PAP cards are able to get bit perfect audio with TMT3 now. In my case I'm still evaluating the merits of dropping bitstreaming in favor of utilizing all of ReClock's potential. The AQ is identical on LPCM sent using exclusive mode vs bitstreaming, and ReClock can only work its magic when using LPCM, so, there are benefits for going that route.

 

[andy o]

I must say I dont really understand what is so good about this? I am today running a Nvidia GT220 where I use 7.1 audio out in TMT (.161) and reclock with exclusive wsapi for PCM and to me it looks like I am getting the full LPCM to my receiver. What is the difference when using .170, a 5xxx card (I have a 5670, but not using it right now) and reclock? I am still not able to get bitsreaming, "only" LPCM, right (I understand that it looks like you are able to get 24bits instead of 16, but any other difference)?

Have you made actual discrete 7.1 channel tests? Chances are that you're getting side-surrounds out of rear-surrounds, and vice versa. Unless Nvidia finally fixed the bug (which would be the second time they fixed it). Nvidia also has the silent stream bug at least with the 9xxx series (laptops and mobos) that have HDMI. Probably the GT2xx cards also do? ATI does too (not the Realtek driver though), but the difference is that they had it with the 4000 series as well, and they fixed it promptly. Nvidia has had it for years now.

Anyway, exclusive mode is also very useful for auto switching. If you have stereo content, it will send stereo to your receiver. If it's 5.1 or 7.1, then it will send just that. Also, auto switches sampling rates.

 

[James]

...and means that non-PAP cards are able to get bit perfect audio with TMT3 now.

No, unfortunately not. TMT3 will downsample / throw away the least significant 8 bits (which really isn't that bad, btw) with non PAP cards due to AACS requirements. Why they are doing this even without AACS present (AnyDVD running) is beyond me.

 

[SamuriHL]

No, unfortunately not. TMT3 will downsample / throw away the least significant 8 bits (which really isn't that bad, btw) with non PAP cards due to AACS requirements. Why they are doing this even without AACS present (AnyDVD running) is beyond me.

So it only works with PAP cards? Well that's a pain. I guess I was mistaken on that one then. Ah well.

 

[barco]

In the setup you quoted, I'm most definitely able to get bitstreaming of TrueHD and DTS-HD MA. Beyond that, all LPCM is sent "as is" to the receiver using exclusive mode...NON-downsampled. That includes PCM decoded from HD DVD and BD. This makes it unnecessary to bitstream at all, and means that non-PAP cards are able to get bit perfect audio with TMT3 now. In my case I'm still evaluating the merits of dropping bitstreaming in favor of utilizing all of ReClock's potential. The AQ is identical on LPCM sent using exclusive mode vs bitstreaming, and ReClock can only work its magic when using LPCM, so, there are benefits for going that route.

Just to make this absolutely clear You are getting bitstreaming at the same time as using reclock? Then I definitely see the benefit! (yeah, the lack of downsampling is of course also nice).

ave you made actual discrete 7.1 channel tests? Chances are that you're getting side-surrounds out of rear-surrounds, and vice versa. Unless Nvidia finally fixed the bug (which would be the second time they fixed it). Nvidia also has the silent stream bug at least with the 9xxx series (laptops and mobos) that have HDMI. Probably the GT2xx cards also do? ATI does too (not the Realtek driver though), but the difference is that they had it with the 4000 series as well, and they fixed it promptly. Nvidia has had it for years now.

Anyway, exclusive mode is also very useful for auto switching. If you have stereo content, it will send stereo to your receiver. If it's 5.1 or 7.1, then it will send just that. Also, auto switches sampling rates.

Hmm, I tried the channelmapping when I was using my ati 5670, but havent yet tried it with my nvidia. Will try it immediately, thanks for the heads up!

The reason for me to dump my ati card was that it does not support customer timings (porches etc) which I need. Will give the ati card a try again now that there is obvious benefits with that one.

 

[SamuriHL]

Just to make this absolutely clear You are getting bitstreaming at the same time as using reclock? Then I definitely see the benefit! (yeah, the lack of downsampling is of course also nice).

Yes, *HOWEVER*, when ReClock is doing bitstreaming passthrough it's very limited as to what it can do for you in terms of video/audio sync. Hence why James made the point that perhaps non-downsampled LPCM might be a better situation. I have to agree in some cases because of issues with 23.xxx Hz playback. But anyway, James added passthrough for HD audio formats so they can be bitstreamed.

Hmm, I tried the channelmapping when I was using my ati 5670, but havent yet tried it with my nvidia. Will try it immediately, thanks for the heads up!

The reason for me to dump my ati card was that it does not support customer timings (porches etc) which I need. Will give the ati card a try again now that there is obvious benefits with that one.

Channel mapping is working for me with my 5870.

 

[barco]

Yes, *HOWEVER*, when ReClock is doing bitstreaming passthrough it's very limited as to what it can do for you in terms of video/audio sync. Hence why James made the point that perhaps non-downsampled LPCM might be a better situation. I have to agree in some cases because of issues with 23.xxx Hz playback. But anyway, James added passthrough for HD audio formats so they can be bitstreamed.

Yes, I read something about the refreshrate "problem" and that you need to be close to the right framerate. My quest is to get a exact multiple of 23.xxx (which I had on my old ati card using powerstrip with 47.953Hz) and if I succeed there shouldnt be a problem I guess.
I cant help wondering how reclock can deal with the PAP protected path though. Isnt the point with PAP to make sure that only "certified" devices/software can take part in the path? Or does reclock leave the bitstreamed audio alone and try to do something with video instead?

Thanks a lot for your (very) quick answers!

 

[SamuriHL]

Yes, I read something about the refreshrate "problem" and that you need to be close to the right framerate. My quest is to get a exact multiple of 23.xxx (which I had on my old ati card using powerstrip with 47.953Hz) and if I succeed there shouldnt be a problem I guess.
I cant help wondering how reclock can deal with the PAP protected path though. Isnt the point with PAP to make sure that only "certified" devices/software can take part in the path? Or does reclock leave the bitstreamed audio alone and try to do something with video instead?

Thanks a lot for your (very) quick answers!

ReClock is performing magic. That's all I can say about that.

 

[barco]

So after messing *a lot" with EDID overrides in Win7 I now have the perfect timings for my ATI. This means that I now have everything I could ever want. TMT3, bitstreaming and perfect matched refresh rate. I am ghosting this machine RIGHT NOW!

Something I have always seen when using reclock is that even though it says I have 1920x1080@47.953Hz it tends to say that it is converting to 24fps when using "auto". The input video says 23.976 (which should be right when playing blurays I guess). Any idea why it is doing this?

Thanks for pushing me into this solution, I would have left the 5670 on the shelf otherwise (and saved MANY hours learning about EDID but worth it now).

 

[SamuriHL]

That's awesome that you have it set up that well now. James would have to answer your question on framerate. That's really odd.

 

[Jong]

We've been badgering James for maybe 2 years on what Reclock reports it is doing. When it says 24Hz it does not mean it. It means it is doing cinema adaptation at or close to 24hz. similarly 60Hz. It is just confusing when you have gone to the trouble of properly matching rates. But James seems not to want to clarify/correct things for reasons I don't understand! It is only a bit of text after all, and the question comes up again and again!

 

[James]

Something I have always seen when using reclock is that even though it says I have 1920x1080@47.953Hz it tends to say that it is converting to 24fps when using "auto". The input video says 23.976 (which should be right when playing blurays I guess). Any idea why it is doing this?

Haven't I just replied to this in another thread?