ReClock 1.8.7.1

[Achernar]

bit-perfect is so yesterday anyway: http://www.gearslutz.com/board/tips-techniques/334385-intersample-peaks.html

Ideally you'd want to attenuate by -3dB to overcome this problem.

Why would bit-perfect be "so yesterday", and why attenuating by -3dB?
This is not a problem but somewhat nonintuitive phenomenon of the reconstuction process (even 10dB overshoot is mentioned).

The link provides info on somewhat unexpected behavior of reconstructed continuous signal at the intersample time/points, somewhere between the nearest left and right samples. It overshoots the values of these samples and it's perfectly within the scope of, and completely predicted by the sampling theory.

This is not some artifact resulting from an incomplete or inadequate theory - in fact, it would be alarming if this was not the case.
As I uderstood it, the whole point of the article is to bring this fact to our, and especially attention of the DA converter designers, which can not assume the sample values give some sort of "upper bound" for the values of reconstructed signal. IMHO.

There's a link to a PDF from Dan Lavry, he's the guru of digital audio...whatever he says is true.

"Lavry's sinc function theorem"... didn't know this elementary definite integral from every basic calculus table has its own name.
With all due respect to mr Lavry.

Thanks for the interesting link (as always ).


Cheers.

 

[leeperry]

Why would bit-perfect be "so yesterday", and why attenuating by -3dB?
This is not a problem but somewhat nonintuitive phenomenon of the reconstuction process (even 10dB overshoot is mentioned).

Well, I didn't read it in full yet, but it'd only make sense that the DAC oversampling stage could/would/will clip on very hot recordings. Reclock has a clip detection algorithm on its resampler output for this very reason.

Dan Lavry is always spot-on like when he called bs on NOS DAC's: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/438220/nos-dac-marketing-bs

Or on long snake oil S/PDIF cables: http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/t/11678/0/

I've done a lot of shootouts, and my best sounding coax cable is 10cm long and made of 75Ω video-grade tinned copper...the shorter the better, always.

I saw a guy selling an Hiface w/ a Japanese blabla coax cable, the damn cable was a half-meter and cost twice more than the Hiface, hah. Better use a USB extension cable and a male/male RCA adapter...the Hiface has async drivers after all.

 

[bbcbear]

Sound stutter at 24FPS using i3/530 and TMT3

I have an i3/530 with integrated gpu and I have been using TMT3 to play discs.
I have heard there is an Intel problem when playing 23.976FPS on this hardware.

My display has 24FPS, 50 and 60Hz. So I have been using the Reclock vbs script to change display frequency very sucessfully. I have an Onkyo amp and have set reclock to accept bitstream and NOT change media speed - as I would prefer one skipped video frame every 40 seconds when watching blu-rays - to not having bitream audio.
50/60Hz DVDs work fine in this mode - but bluerays suffer sound drop outs very few seconds.

I have a log - but how do it attach it - as it says it is too big to upload ?
Would someone help me out - please !!

 

[James]

I have an i3/530 with integrated gpu and I have been using TMT3 to play discs.
I have heard there is an Intel problem when playing 23.976FPS on this hardware.

My display has 24FPS, 50 and 60Hz. So I have been using the Reclock vbs script to change display frequency very sucessfully. I have an Onkyo amp and have set reclock to accept bitstream and NOT change media speed - as I would prefer one skipped video frame every 40 seconds when watching blu-rays - to not having bitream audio.
50/60Hz DVDs work fine in this mode - but bluerays suffer sound drop outs very few seconds.

I have a log - but how do it attach it - as it says it is too big to upload ?
Would someone help me out - please !!

"zip" it using WinZip or Windows compressed folders or....

 

[bbcbear]

Log file attached - thanks for taking a look James.

 

[leeperry]

James, if you don't mind me asking...for some reason Reclock believes that NTSC Film is 30fps and not 29.97...so if I play a 29.97fps in 89.91Hz, it says that it's playing it at 30fps

anyways, let's say that I wanna play a 29.97fps movie twice slower in 89.91Hz...should I pick 0.5x 29.97fps / 05.x30fps / refresh rate divided by 6(that doesn't exist atm)? Will they all do the same stuff

and if you really want some slow motion, it isn't really possible atm? any chance you could allow even slower speeds please? If I play a 25fps movie in 100Hz, the slowest I can get is "refresh rate/20"? so that's 5fps...It'd be nice to be able to go down to 1fps

 

[bbcbear]

Sound stutter at 24FPS using i3/530 and TMT3

"I have an i3/530 with integrated gpu and I have been using TMT3 to play discs.
I have heard there is an Intel problem when playing 23.976FPS on this hardware.

My display has 24FPS, 50 and 60Hz. So I have been using the Reclock vbs script to change display frequency very sucessfully. I have an Onkyo amp and have set reclock to accept bitstream and NOT change media speed - as I would prefer one skipped video frame every 40 seconds when watching blu-rays - to not having bitream audio.
50/60Hz DVDs work fine in this mode - but bluerays suffer sound drop outs very few seconds."

Solved - The audio drop outs only occur when TMT3 is in a window - Reclock works fine with TMT3 full frame - can someone explain why ?

 

[red5goahead]

James. Do Reclock use the event driven mode or not with wasapi exc. mode? Reclock seems work fine with wasapi and a Xonar DX audio card with official last driver though I have to set WasapiBufferSize to 50 ms due a initial lipsynch with default at 100 ms . I ask you because Media Portal developers are writing a new audio renderer and an evr video renderer to reach an high quality playback and vsynch control . MP devs choose to use only wasapi because the target will be MP 2.0 under Windows Vista or Windows 7. I'm testing with a Windows Vista, MP 1.2 and a Xonar Dx. the current results are very good.
But using event driven mode seems Xonar Dx have some problem maybe due to a driver problem. I'm just wondering why Reclock work fine and MP audio renderer not using event mode driven and work when this mode is disabled.

 

[leeperry]

to be perfectly clear...I just wanted to know if when playing 29.97fps@89.910Hz, there was a difference between picking "29.97fps" "30fps" and "refreshrate/3"? and of course their "0.5x" counterparts.

the two first options are confusing...which one will follow the refresh rate at 89.910Hz? 30fps

 

[James]

James, if you don't mind me asking...for some reason Reclock believes that NTSC Film is 30fps and not 29.97...so if I play a 29.97fps in 89.91Hz, it says that it's playing it at 30fps

Little do I know ... without a logfile.
DShow estimator? Turn it off for a try.

anyways, let's say that I wanna play a 29.97fps movie twice slower in 89.91Hz...should I pick 0.5x 29.97fps / 05.x30fps / refresh rate divided by 6(that doesn't exist atm)? Will they all do the same stuff

They will do the stuff they say - which can be the same, depending on refresh rates, source media speed, ...

and if you really want some slow motion, it isn't really possible atm? any chance you could allow even slower speeds please? If I play a 25fps movie in 100Hz, the slowest I can get is "refresh rate/20"? so that's 5fps...It'd be nice to be able to go down to 1fps

This requires an insane amount of sound buffer memory, I intentionally removed this.

 

[James]

James. Do Reclock use the event driven mode or not with wasapi exc. mode?

Nope, ReClock polls for better compatibility.

 

[leeperry]

They will do the stuff they say - which can be the same, depending on refresh rates, source media speed, ...

This requires an insane amount of sound buffer memory, I intentionally removed this.

I mean Reclock says that it'll do 24.000fps CINEMA adaptation even if you play a 23.976fps movie at 23.976fps..it also believe that NTSC video is 30fps and not 29.97:

so if NTSC video is treated as 30fps...what's the point to have 29.97 and 30fps in the adaptation options? and let's say I wanna play a 29.97fps video at half speed in 59.94Hz...do these 3 options do the same? "0.5x29.97" "0.5x30" and "refresh rate/2"?

If I play a 24fps movie in 24Hz and choose "refresh rate/20", I will get 1.2fps....not allowing more than "refresh rate/20" is only a problem for high refresh rates, you've got something against the CRT ppl?

And 1fps would be seldom used for a few secs...not like anyone is gonna watch a movie at that rate.

I've got the Dshow thingie disabled, only the built-in estimator is.

 

[James]

I mean Reclock says that it'll do 24.000fps CINEMA adaptation even if you play a 23.976fps movie at 23.976fps..it also believe that NTSC video is 30fps and not 29.97:

so if NTSC video is treated as 30fps...

No, it's not. I believe it's the usual "display bug", erm, I mean "feature". Whatever.

 

[leeperry]

No, it's not. I believe it's the usual "display bug", erm, I mean "feature". Whatever.

That's what I thought, but then what's the point to add adaptation options around 29.97 and 30fps? and I guess you'll agree that not offering higher than "refresh rate/20" is only a problem for CRT ppl? If you can have 1fps in 24Hz, there's no good reason to disallow it in 100Hz

 

[GrandeBoma]

I am sure there is something I am setting wrong, but when i slow down PAL dvd's to 24p or use pitch shift on bd that have wrong pitch (LOTR an example has same pitch as dvd despite 24p frequency) I can't resample to 96 kHz... any reason as to why it happens?

 

[soulkeeper]

i installed reclock..
i'm using mpc-hc with evr-sync with the 3 options for v-sync off,ffdshow with avisynth script to double the framerate(2x23,976),my display at @60hz,windows 7 64bit with aero enabled..
in reclock i check bitstreaming audio and media display rate change unchecked...
so when i start a movie ,in reclock properties the vsync options at the bottom are greyed out....

is still reclock doing it's magic as to eliminate judder caused from different fps/refresh rate??

PS.ofcourse the red and green line are far from ideal(flat at least for the red line) but i think it's normal for fps/ref.rate diff.

 

[Jong]

What you are doing is a bad idea. By frame doubling from 23.976 you are left with 47.952 frames to fit into 60 displayed frames per second. There is no good way to do that (irregular judder) and there is no way to fix vsync as there is no regular cadence.

You should either stick with the original 23.976 frames which Reclcok will speed up to 24fps and which then will be automatically uprated to 60Hz by use of 3:2 pulldown or you need to go all the way and convert 23.976fps to 60fps.

 

[WayToGo]

I'm playing a 7-second flac file with mpc-hc and a tiny bit at the end is cut-off when using ReClock (default settings). Mpc-hc w/out ReClock and Winamp, play it fine. Is this to be expected with audio files? Is the loading/unloading of ReClock causing this, since that portion of the audio is at the very end?

 

[soulkeeper]

What you are doing is a bad idea. By frame doubling from 23.976 you are left with 47.952 frames to fit into 60 displayed frames per second. There is no good way to do that (irregular judder) and there is no way to fix vsync as there is no regular cadence.

You should either stick with the original 23.976 frames which Reclcok will speed up to 24fps and which then will be automatically uprated to 60Hz by use of 3:2 pulldown or you need to go all the way and convert 23.976fps to 60fps.

yes,you're right that the i should stick with interpolating to 60fps in order to have judder free play,but the problem is that interpolating to double the frames has much better results(less artifacts,less "soap opera" effect) than interpolating to 60fps...that's why i asked about how reclock deals with 47.952fps/60hz....

PS. but as i mentioned,i did some quick tests and although red line was not flat ,it had "waves" but in the same periods....the result was much better than i expected but i have to do some more tests although it's not the known 3:2 pulldown...

Any comment for this:
"In reclock i check bitstreaming audio and media display rate change unchecked...
so when i start a movie ,in reclock properties the vsync options at the bottom are greyed out....

is still reclock doing it's magic as to eliminate judder caused from different fps/refresh rate??"

in other words what do i select in the options tab in order to make vsync option available?

 

[Jong]

I understand the dilemma but if you do not like the effect of 23.976fps -> 60fps interpolation the best you can do is playback at the original speed and let Reclock speed up 23.976fps to 24fps for perfect 3:2 pulldown. Vsync correction can then be applied.

@47.952fps Reclock cannot really do anything. Well it can stabilise the clcoks so there is less drift but it cannot speed up or slow down by any sensible amount to get an even cadence so it just plays back at the original frame rate. You will simply get a repeated frame once every 3.98008 frames.

Without a regular cadence Reclock vsync correction cannot be applied.