Blocked BD copy playback (Cinavia)

[fast eddie]

Cinavia is a nuisance and nothing more. It is not even at the level of "harmful or disturbing".

And, that is just your opinion, and certainly not the majority viewpoint in the DVD world.

 

[whurlston]

Are you saying that the majority viewpoint is that Cinavia is actually harmful? I would like some proof of that (of both the majority viewpoint and of it being harmful). The majority of people have no clue that Cinavia even exists.

 

[omegaman7]

Indeed. A buddy with a PS3 is the first I heard about it None of my hardware detects it. I'd probably be in the dark if it weren't for $ony's PS3...

 

[NewUser1]

Are you saying that the majority viewpoint is that Cinavia is actually harmful? I would like some proof of that (of both the majority viewpoint and of it being harmful). The majority of people have no clue that Cinavia even exists.

Yea it's harmful to those consumers who legally purchase Blu Rays & DVD's. They have every right to make a legal back up copy for their own personal fair use.

Expecting the discs to play on their equipment is not an unreasonable expectation.

 

[andy o]

If I'm not mistaken, what whurlston is saying is this. DRAMA!

 

[whurlston]

Yea it's harmful to those consumers who legally purchase Blu Rays & DVD's. They have every right to make a legal back up copy for their own personal fair use.

Expecting the discs to play on their equipment is not an unreasonable expectation.

"harmful":

damaging: causing damage or injury

"annoying":

causing irritation: causing mild anger or impatience

Synonyms: maddening, irritating, infuriating, bothersome, exasperating, aggravating, frustrating, trying, grating

Unless you have some proof that Cinavia is causing you to go deaf or something to that affect, it does not meet the definition of "harmful". It definitely has not harmed me or any of my legally purchased Blurays and DVDs.

If I'm not mistaken, what whurlston is saying is this. DRAMA!

 

[NewUser1]

"harmful":

damaging: causing damage or injury

Synonyms of the word harmful: affliction, injury, detriment, harm.

I, and many others, feel Cinavia is a detriment to our right to enjoy and watch backups we created legally from purchased films.

"annoying":

causing irritation: causing mild anger or impatience

So you agree with me and others on the above . Cinavia has caused many people various forms of anger. Finding the solution to address it has caused many people impatience.

Unless you have some proof that Cinavia is causing you to go deaf or something to that affect, it does not meet the definition of "harmful". It definitely has not harmed me or any of my legally purchased Blurays and DVDs.

Incorrect. It does .

Carry on.

 

[whurlston]

So you agree with me and others on the above

Not if you believe that annoying = harmful. There is a big difference between the two.

A mosquito is annoying. A mosquito carrying malaria (which is a virus) is harmful.

Cinavia has caused many people various forms of anger. Finding the solution to address it has caused many people impatience.

As I said, it's annoying... not harmful.

 

[NewbieGuy1]

Not if you believe that annoying = harmful. There is a big difference between the two.

Didn't address the facts I presented.

"annoying":
causing irritation: causing mild anger or impatience

Cinavia causes many consumers anger.

You appear to have a problem when your own comments are presented to support different viewpoints.

My responses to you which include your comments, support what I have said from the beginning.

No need in going back and forth with you any longer as you seem unwilling to stand behind your words when they are presented by others.

Have a nice day .

 

[bakerie]

Guys, I'm not going to promote piracy here or anything, but i'm a pirate, and I want to let you know why Cinavia is but a slight inconvenience to me, and it's only real harm is towards legitimate consumers.

So I discover MIB 3 has Cinavia. Cinavia is a fantastic copy right measure and it's one of those things I wish I had of created, the guys that designed this did a great job. As you can see from the posts in this forum, it's extremely robust.

Now, I go to my illeagelmoviedownloads.com website, download my fantastic looking 8gb HD copy of MIB 3. While that starts, I find a DVD version of MIB 3 with AC3 audio. I now download both. The DVD version is usually only 1.5gb or so in size, so it's finished in about 15 mins, and considering I'll have to wait about 2 hours for the BR version to download, this doesn't matter to me.

Now, both are now downloaded, so I simply open a muxing tool, like tsMuxeR, select the audio stream from the DVD and the video from the BR, click on save and in a minute or two I'm done. Cinavia removed 5.1 surround sound and HD video.

My life is no harder than it was two years ago.
----------------------------

Now who IS inconvenienced and effected by Cinavia? The people who handed money over for a Blu-ray.

These people might like to keep their collection on a PC media server to send to their PS3, or simply make back-ups so the kids can't ruin the good copies. These people don't want to go to illeagelmoviedownloads.com and download a DVD audio track illeagally, because if they wanted to pirate a movie, they wouldn't have handed over money in the first place.


Cinavia is awesome from a technical point of view, but from a fair use point of view for people who want to pay money (and quite a high sum at that) to have a movie at their disposal, it's just terrible.

 

[whurlston]

Didn't address the facts I presented.



Cinavia causes many consumers anger.

You appear to have a problem when your own comments are presented to support different viewpoints.

My responses to you which include your comments, support what I have said from the beginning.

No need in going back and forth with you any longer as you seem unwilling to stand behind your words when they are presented by others.

Have a nice day .

Um... what? You must be misunderstanding my posts? I have said from the beginning that Cinavia is annoying (causing anger) just as you quoted me saying. But it is ONLY annoying, not harmful.

 

[Adbear]

Guys, I'm not going to promote piracy here or anything, but i'm a pirate, and I want to let you know why Cinavia is but a slight inconvenience to me, and it's only real harm is towards legitimate consumers.

So I discover MIB 3 has Cinavia. Cinavia is a fantastic copy right measure and it's one of those things I wish I had of created, the guys that designed this did a great job. As you can see from the posts in this forum, it's extremely robust.

Now, I go to my illeagelmoviedownloads.com website, download my fantastic looking 8gb HD copy of MIB 3. While that starts, I find a DVD version of MIB 3 with AC3 audio. I now download both. The DVD version is usually only 1.5gb or so in size, so it's finished in about 15 mins, and considering I'll have to wait about 2 hours for the BR version to download, this doesn't matter to me.

Now, both are now downloaded, so I simply open a muxing tool, like tsMuxeR, select the audio stream from the DVD and the video from the BR, click on save and in a minute or two I'm done. Cinavia removed 5.1 surround sound and HD video.

My life is no harder than it was two years ago.
----------------------------

Now who IS inconvenienced and effected by Cinavia? The people who handed money over for a Blu-ray.

These people might like to keep their collection on a PC media server to send to their PS3, or simply make back-ups so the kids can't ruin the good copies. These people don't want to go to illeagelmoviedownloads.com and download a DVD audio track illeagally, because if they wanted to pirate a movie, they wouldn't have handed over money in the first place.


Cinavia is awesome from a technical point of view, but from a fair use point of view for people who want to pay money (and quite a high sum at that) to have a movie at their disposal, it's just terrible.

Not always possible to do this as more and more movies have Cinavia watermarked audio on both the DVD and the Blu-ray, also what do you do about different cuts of the movie that aren't available on the DVD version? Your method would only work if you have a Blu-ray that doesn't use seamless branching and the DVD hasn't also got Cinavia watermarking. Even if you make the seamless branched Blu-ray into a single file you may find that the muxed audio from the DVD starts to drift out of synch later in the film due to the fraction of a second differences where each file joins

 

[bakerie]

Oh it's not perfect, it just works on general releases (or at least has on the three I've used this method on).

I'd rather have Blu-Ray audio anyway.

 

[bakerie]

Until I get a proper PC, I can't help with this stuff. Someone insert a 15KHZ white noise tone into a Cinavia protected audio file and also remove any audio gaps that you should see appearing every 20 seconds or so. This should remove it, but will have to be done manually unless someone here has the programming skills to make something to detect these gaps and remove. Now this will reduce the audio file to be about 6 minutes short for a 2 hour movie. Stretch this out to the correct length and you're done.

I've wanted to do this for a while, but I'm on a crappy netbook and audio manipulation takes years.

 

[Adbear]

If you had an audio gap every 20 seconds then you'd notice it even if it was for only 1 frame, and going by your calculations it'd be for approx 1 second every 20 seconds or so which would definitely be noticeable on the original audio track.

 

[bakerie]

Derp. Never post stuff first thing in the morning with a hangover.

It's more like a 30th of a frame. Load something into an audio editor and you'll see it.

 

[tectpro]

Have you ever listen to a 15khz white noise?
If you add this you can for sure hear it.
If not something's wrong with your ears.

 

[whurlston]

Have you ever listen to a 15khz white noise?
If you add this you can for sure hear it.
If not something's wrong with your ears.

As can be experienced here: http://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_frequencycheckhigh.php

Side note: Technically, a 15khz tone would not be white noise (an even distribution across all frequencies). It would be a single tone (the upper limit of blue noise and the lower limit of violet noise).

 

[terster]

I'm Still Confused

Hi, I'm a touch confused by this protection and how it works. I've looked at the Wiki and that didn't help as it's not in layman's terms.

I have a Sony BDP-S580. My understanding is that this is PRE (before) Cinavia, even with current firmware. Does anyone know if this is true? That the hardware does not support it?

Secondly, my understanding is that this ONLY affects those that make exact backups of their Blu-ray disks. Is that true? It's only when a 1 to 1 backup is made?

If that is right, that means if you convert a B/R disk to an MP4 and then stream to your Blu-ray or Roku player, you are not affected by this. Is that right too?

Finally, i found a site that says that they can strip this out when making 1 to 1 backups and more, but their software is seriously expensive.

My immediate reaction when i saw their site, was to come here and ask. It's the DVDFab.

I don't understand why one would want that or need it, because again, if all you're doing is ripping a B/R disk into an MP4, the Cinavia is gone.

Or am i very confused on how this all works?

Can anyone answer about my Blu-ray player as well as how this Cinavia works especially with regard to converting to MP4 (or other formats) as well as full 1 to 1 backup's of your blu-ray disks?

Please advise. Sorry for the newbie question. And thanks for allowing my questions. I hope this was the right forum for it.

Thanks

 

[Ch3vr0n]

Hi, I'm a touch confused by this protection and how it works. I've looked at the Wiki and that didn't help as it's not in layman's terms.

I have a Sony BDP-S580. My understanding is that this is PRE (before) Cinavia, even with current firmware. Does anyone know if this is true? That the hardware does not support it

That is pretty easy to know, if the player's production date is before Feb 1st of this year it doesn't and never will support it.

Secondly, my understanding is that this ONLY affects those that make exact backups of their Blu-ray disks. Is that true? It's only when a 1 to 1 backup is made

Wrong, even disc shrunk in size or what we call "movie-only" backups are affected. As the signal is in the main movie.

If that is right, that means if you convert a B/R disk to an MP4 and then stream to your Blu-ray or Roku player, you are not affected by this. Is that right too?

Wrong atleast partially, the ps3 is again one that can detect cinavia in streaming if certain conditions are met. The audio signal is not removed if you convert to a mobile format, play the mp4 directly (not streaming) with a player that supports cinavia and it will trigger

Finally, i found a site that says that they can strip this out when making 1 to 1 backups and more, but their software is seriously expensive.

My immediate reaction when i saw their site, was to come here and ask. It's the DVDFab.

That is the bdmv-rec loophole and it is not stripped at all the signal, it is a workarround and only works if the ps3 uses firmware before version 4. Starting with firmware v4 that loopholes has been closed by sony

I don't understand why one would want that or need it, because again, if all you're doing is ripping a B/R disk into an MP4, the Cinavia is gone.

No it is not conversion to a mobile format does not remove the signal. It is still present in the mp4 file and will trigger cinavia if played directly on a player that supports cinavia detection[/quote]

Or am i very confused on how this all works?

Can anyone answer about my Blu-ray player as well as how this Cinavia works especially with regard to converting to MP4 (or other formats) as well as full 1 to 1 backup's of your blu-ray disks?

Please advise. Sorry for the newbie question. And thanks for allowing my questions. I hope this was the right forum for it.

Thanks

You have it all wrong. Cinavia is complex stuff.

Verstuurd van mijn HTC Sensation XE with Beats Audio Z715e met Tapatalk