Upscale 720P to 1080P

[DrXenos]

Those don't look good at all. They don't look enhanced, just overly smooth with a complete lack of detail and grain.

 

[DaveO88]

Topaz is the best I've found so far also....and depending on the video , it can be very slow. results depend on what you have to work with. A low quality, high bitrate file can work wonders.
Keep in mind...these programs are working on a frame by frame basis so that's also a consideration in speed.

In my opinion...you'll get better results going from 720p to 4K then reencoding to 1080p.

I enlarged the DVD images to 1080p for comparison...

I actually missed one and the frames are not exactly the same, but you can see the results of the AI software. YES...I did the entire series and it took a few months.

for me it makes no difference as the upscaling to 1080p only takes 3 hours with and 5 hours for 4k

 

[Jimc115]

Those don't look good at all. They don't look enhanced, just overly smooth with a complete lack of detail and grain.

Then you need your eyes checked. Yes...the grain was removed. there is an option to keep it in....but you honestly can't say the detail is not enhanced.

 

[DrXenos]

Then you need your eyes checked. Yes...the grain was removed. there is an option to keep it in....but you honestly can't say the detail is not enhanced.

No, that's my point. All the original film grain is gone. That bad, in my opinion. And yes, I can honestly say the detail is not enhanced. It's simply looks like someone cranked up a denoise filter to 11.

 

[cartman0208]

I'm not a fan of grain, noise and motion blur, and I'm probly one of the few HFR fans here, so I think the reworked ones look definetely better.
But it's still frames ... how does it look in motion?

 

[DrXenos]

I'm not a fan of grain, noise and motion blur, and I'm probly one of the few HFR fans here, so I think the reworked ones look definetely better.
But it's still frames ... how does it look in motion?

I prefer a balance. I think attempting to remove all the grain from a movie shot on film, will affect its integrity. I guess we can agree to disagree on the results, but that one shot of General Hammond is so smooth and lacking in detail, he looks like Charlie Brown.

 

[coopervid]

I prefer a balance. I think attempting to remove all the grain from a movie shot on film, will affect its integrity. I guess we can agree to disagree on the results, but that one shot of General Hammond is so smooth and lacking in detail, he looks like Charlie Brown.

I second that. Oversharpening is as bad as 60Hz for movies that then look like soap operas. But all is a matter of preferences. It will be an endless discussion. I'm not against higher refresh rates >24Hz but I just read an article that they want to go back to 50 or something as they detected that many people have this soap opera perception I have.

 

[Jimc115]

Grain definitely has a place in older movies. If you remove it, it almost does give a fake look...this is simply a TV series...grain, I could care less about.
I'll send you a link privately to an episode....not into violating any rules today.

DrXenos...there are dozens of models or you can make the adjustments yourself...this was a basic first attempt using the program. The end result is going to be personal taste and preference
and more importantly....the file you put in itself. You aren't gong to be able to do much with a bad file to start with. Files with a lot of bitrate work best. Even in the above examples, the results
are not truly accurate because I used Photoshop to enlarge the 480p image. Photoshop by design enhanced the picture when I enlarged it.

 

[Jimc115]

I second that. Oversharpening is as bad as 60Hz for movies that then look like soap operas. But all is a matter of preferences. It will be an endless discussion. I'm not against higher refresh rates >24Hz but I just read an article that they want to go back to 50 or something as they detected that many people have this soap opera perception I have.

50-60 work well in Sports with lots of motion....and I agree...Soap Operas do look terrible.

 

[Heracles]

Topaz is the best I've found so far also....

In my opinion...you'll get better results going from 720p to 4K then reencoding to 1080p.

I enlarged the DVD images to 1080p for comparison...

(above edited by Mike for response)

Jimc115,

I might try a few tests, I've been going directly to 1080p, any suggestions for improvement are appreciated!

********

Fyi for those that might be interested,

Topaz AI on sale till 11/7 for $159 - normally $299 - plus use November 15% discount code "GETVIDEOAI" for $135 total.

New October major product version release of Topaz AI (3.0.2 now) with new features is slightly buggy and they are working on fixing and I'm also using older 2.5.4 version that I was able to download when I purchased on 10/30/22.

Mike

 

[RedFox 1]

(above edited by Mike for response)

Jimc115,

I might try a few tests, I've been going directly to 1080p, any suggestions for improvement are appreciated!

********

Fyi for those that might be interested,

Topaz AI on sale till 11/7 for $159 - normally $299 - plus use November 15% discount code "GETVIDEOAI" for $135 total.

New October major product version release of Topaz AI (3.0.2 now) with new features is slightly buggy and they are working on fixing and I'm also using older 2.5.4 version that I was able to download when I purchased on 10/30/22.

Mike

I like the software but it takes way too long for the minimal upscale effects. JMO.

 

[tectpro]

Maybe have a look at open source "AI" upscaler.

https://github.com/xinntao/Real-ESRGAN

https://github.com/xinntao/ESRGAN


https://github.com/AaronFeng753/Waifu2x-Extension-GUI

https://github.com/nullArrayList/Real-CUGAN/blob/master/README_EN.md

There some more that can be found.
Maybe not as "easy" to use as TopazLab.

 

[tectpro]

Topaz is the best I've found so far also....and depending on the video , it can be very slow. results depend on what you have to work with. A low quality, high bitrate file can work wonders.
Keep in mind...these programs are working on a frame by frame basis so that's also a consideration in speed.

In my opinion...you'll get better results going from 720p to 4K then reencoding to 1080p.

I enlarged the DVD images to 1080p for comparison...

View attachment 67785
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View attachment 67787
View attachment 67788


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I actually missed one and the frames are not exactly the same, but you can see the results of the AI software. YES...I did the entire series and it took a few months.

Looks bit like the set I bought here

https://www.visualentertainment.tv/products/copy-of-stargate-sg-1-the-complete-series-7150-blu-ray

 

[Heracles]

I like the software but it takes way too long for the minimal upscale effects. JMO.

Redfox,

I don't know if I agree with this, yet.

I've only been using this for a week and am *really* liking it.

I'm converting some older stuff first that's sub 720, then I'll do some 720 stuff.

I guess it depends a lot on your source file, your computer system(s) and your graphics card(s).

I'm currently using Win10/64 Pro, RTX 3080ti, 32Gb Ram, I7 12,700k on my new system I just built.

I also have the older Win10/64 Pro, RTX 2070 Super, 16Gb Ram, Skylake that I can use if I wanted to.

I'm running one instance of this in the background while downloading dozens of episodes from a streaming service and using Chrome for browsing and working on Excel budgeting spreadsheets.

Here's an example of upscaling a film (Cocoon) that I really like that I had in a lower resolution using Topaz AI 2.6.4 (older version) that I'm converting right now.

It estimates 5 hours for conversion, but I've learned estimates on computers are really crappy and sometimes have no relationship to reality.

I've wanted a better copy of this for a while and will just let it run.

Upscaling Cocoon
Input: Original H265
Input: Dimensions 856x464
Input: 4,568 Kb/s

Settings:

29 Revert Compress
16 Recover Details
20 Sharpen
50 Reduce Noise
8 Dehalo
-2 Antialias/Deblur
2.4 Grain Amount
1.2 Grain Size
17 Constant Rate
Yes Keep Audio

Output:

H264
1920x1080

Attaching some screen shots of currently running conversion/upscaling.

Mike

 

[Heracles]

This turned out to be a wonderful upscale that actually took 6 hours to do.

It plays flawlessly into the back of my Roku Ultra USB port to my 1080p Samsung 55 inch TV - watching it now and about 30 minutes into Cocoon.

It *looks" like a Blu Ray with the conversion parameters I did and the built in upscaling in the Roku Ultra from the USB.

This Ultra Roku (with it's upscaling) is probably a *really* good investment for people to get, especially those with some older TV's like I have.

Got one on each Tv & bought for under $70 each on sale - I'm sure they'll have them near that price on Black Friday & upcoming sales.

I think the adding of grain was the kicker upper.

*But* the file is about 22.4mg H264, have not compressed it to H265 yet.

1. Running another test with altering of two of the parameters to see what file size for the H264 results, I think I overdid it on Noise and Constant Bit Rate parameters for a 1080p file and was going off what a youtube video showed but that was a Blu Ray.

Reduce Noise changing to 30
Constant Bit Rate to 23

I can't tell a huge difference from preview with the above 2 changes compared to previous settings (see a couple of screen attachments) but there is a quality difference.

Again, it estimates the same amount of time to be ~ 5 1/2 hours, so it'll probably take about 6 hours.

This runtime in background is ok for a movie I really like to get the quality bump especially considering the source of 856x464 to 1920x1080.

With new TV Series, it's a lot of time, but doing 2 or so when they come out is very doable.

I also think I'll run another instance to see what that does to runtime using a AHS season 11 from Hulu to 1080 as a test - 6 episodes so far.

2. I'm also gonna convert the first file to H265 and compare it quality of run #2.

I might just run at higher noise & constant bit rate and then convert.

But the quality of 1st one is *amazing* for one of my favorite movies.

I'm just learning this upscaling stuff & messing around with parameters.

Again, the runtime will depend on the other processes running, the source, your PC and your graphics card.

Can you imagine what they can do with upscaling AI a few years from now?

Estimates of AHS conversion from 720 to 1080p last episode of Season 11 from Hulu is 3 hours

By the way the way I got the setting for everything was I did about 30 estimates at various points using Topaz AI 2.6.4 for "suggested" settings, put them in a spread sheet and averaged them.

This seemed to work out good.

I did fudge the Noise Reduction settings based on a video I watched, but am going to move it down closer to the averaging of 30 suggestions, if not actually too that.

Mike

 

[DrXenos]

This turned out to be a wonderful upscale that actually took 6 hours to do.

Those look surprisingly good, especially the one with the water.

 

[RedFox 1]

I am not that much of a videophile where every scene has to be perfect. I watch the movie and I go to bed. Most movies are fine for me in 720p, I only have a 40" old LED TV so I am not as into the finer points of every scene. To each his own, to me, if I have to wait that long and have to look that closely to see a difference it's not for me. But I am very happy you are happy with it. Enjoy.

 

[DaveO88]

Well, most of them have a larger TV and preferably in 4K and it gets very extreme with what you see in terms of compression errors, noise or film grain. For my part, I only edit films that are only available on DVD or the resolution in the download is no longer available or UHD Disc films that have been remastered from old films but where you think the regraders were too drunk to do anything decent To create for the UHD, that means: only certain films and not every one that would actually go beyond the time frame

 

[Heracles]

I am not that much of a videophile where every scene has to be perfect. I watch the movie and I go to bed. Most movies are fine for me in 720p, I only have a 40" old LED TV so I am not as into the finer points of every scene. To each his own, to me, if I have to wait that long and have to look that closely to see a difference it's not for me. But I am very happy you are happy with it. Enjoy.

Redfox,

I also don't consider myself a "videophile" nor an "audiophile", even if you might.

Aiming for 1080p as an output with the best video and sound I can get, I can see myself being laughed at by what I consider to be videophiles/audiophiles.

I can tell the video/sound difference on my 1080p 10 year old Tv 55 inch living room Tv and attached Sony DVD player (BDV-E3100 -seeing used ones for under $200/new ~$350) that has emulation for stereo to 6Ch Dolby and does a pretty good job that I use for the sound.

( I can tell the difference between 2 channel emulation & real 6 channel separation)

Not so much on my smaller offish brand 40 inch TV (Hisense) using it's sound & another Roku Ultra (that does make a difference).

The Roku Ultra with USB also helps on both (video upscaling/ease of use USB), especially since the TV doesn't even have a lot of the streaming channel apps due to licensing issues/expiration (they go away after some years) with Samsung.

The Roku Ultra is also nice to attach a USB 3.1 Docking station (StarTech/$72 Walmart) that I can put one of my 16TB backup drive's in to play movies via the USB port.

I feel no need to upgrade either the TV or sound and being a child of the 60's that grew up with B&W tube TV's, I can live just fine with 1080p and feel that's my comfort zone.

Having not gone to the theater in the past few years due to Covid, it's an enjoyable configuration and not too pricey.

Mike

 

[RedFox 1]

I absolutely understand. And I am thrilled you found something that is a part hobby and part enjoyment and also learning about how audio and video affect a good movie. Everyone has different expectations when they sit down to watch a movie and that's great. I actually used the Topaz AI video enhancer, I just found it took too much of my time for too little return, everyone has different expectations. I respect your efforts and am happy that you enjoy doing what you do to watch and enjoy a movie in your comfort zone. I have a bit less of a threshold for what I expect in a film, I was absolutely happy with DVDs in the early part of this century and those were only 480p. I live in a place where just having any type of video in your home is considered upper-class. So my expectations are less than yours. I have very poor eyesight so maybe that's the reason I can't see that much of a difference between 720p or 1080p or an upscaled 1080p. I grew up in an era of video newsreels and reel-to-reel tape. So when I saw the DVD it totally blew me away. When I saw my first TV program in the mid-1940s, I couldn't believe it. So please take that into consideration when I say it really doesn't make the movie any better entertainment for me whether it's 720p or 1080p. To me, the technology is amazing. I meant no disrespect when I said it doesn't make a difference to me.