PowerDVD 8.0 Ultra Released!

[James]

I really cant believe that this is possible. PDVD7 doesnt have a decoder for more than 6 channels. Please check if you have any kind of channel expander active, CLMEI2, DTS NEO, Dolby PLII etc. what does your "about" window tell about the audio channel decode capabilities while playing back SAW?

Nope. No expanders whatsoever (they are broken in PDVD7 anyway).
PowerDVD says this:

Audio Attributes:
Audio Coding mode: DTS
Sampling Rate: 48kHz
Number of Audio channels: 7.1
Bitrate: 2046 Kbps

ALso make sure your sound card driver doesnt expand to 8 channels when getting a 6 channel input, some cards do that automatically.

Nope.

As I said, CL themselves said to me that PDVD7 doesnt decode all 8 channels, only 6 max:

Maybe they are wrong? Come on, they are just poor support people. Telling you what they have been told.

 

[w1seman]

Nope. No expanders whatsoever (they are broken in PDVD7 anyway).
PowerDVD says this:

Audio Attributes:
Audio Coding mode: DTS
Sampling Rate: 48kHz
Number of Audio channels: 7.1
Bitrate: 2046 Kbps



Nope.


Maybe they are wrong? Come on, they are just poor support people. Telling you what they have been told.

Well, lets start different. OK, I think we are talking about different things James!

It doesn't matter what the Info Window of the setup part of PDVD7 tells you. Thats just the Info about what the original audio file contains. Thats NOT what PDVD7 actually can decode! You have to look elsewhere: Play the movie make sure the 7.1 track is running. Then right-click anywhere on the movie window and select "about". Then click on the "licensed to" as if you would check the version of PDVD. Then there are 2 lines containing the info about the capabilities of PDVD7 of outputting and decoding of audio. And there always only stands a 6 for decoding.

How did u check, that u get real 7.1 output besides this misleading info in the setup window? Do you have a level meter for each channel in your soundcards drivers? Or do you have a 7.1 loudspecker setup and listened if every loudspeaker gives out sound when CLMEI2 disabled?

Regards

PS: btw. about how DTS-HD codecs work:

http://www.dtsonline.com/pro-audio/mas_encoding.php

 

[w1seman]

Yeah, I did notice that too, but I don't know how much trust you can put on that info window. I still am unsure that the DTS-HD MA tracks have a DTS core also embedded and a normal lossy DTS-HD track. I don't see any reason for them to do it, unless it is absolutely effortless and cost-less for them. It is this case of Pan's Labyrinth, actually, that made me realize that the DTS core is only 5.1 (although it's kind of a "duh" realization) and if the DTS-HD MA track also had a normal lossy DTS-HD embedded, then I see no reason for it not to be 7.1 as well.

DTS-HD and DTS-HD MA basically have the same architecture. Both have a DTS 5.1 or in some cases Embedded 6.1 core. Both have an HD-Extension and can have a 96 or even 192 kHz-extension. The main (only?) difference between HD and HD MA is that HD is "only" CBR whereas HD MA is "VBR".

 

[James]

How did u check, that u get real 7.1 output besides this misleading info in the setup window? Do you have a level meter for each channel in your siundcards drivers? Or do you have a 7.1 loudspecker setup and listened if every loudspeaker gives out sound when CLMEI2 disabled?

I used my ears. Couldn't miss the surround back speakers. And yes, Dolby PL IIx etc. were off. And yes, SB speakers are silent when playing back 5.1 material with same settings.

You're right, the about box says "decoder capabilities 6 channels". Maybe they are counting the main channels? And I "only" hear 6.1. and not 7.1? I honestly can't tell. Maybe it is simply wrong? Wouldn't be the only "wrong" thing with this program. PDVD7 always could decode DTS-ES 6.1.
The same disc contains DTS-ES 6.1 tracks, and back surround works fine.

 

[w1seman]

I used my ears. Couldn't miss the surround back speakers. And yes, Dolby PL IIx etc. were off. And yes, SB speakers are silent when playing back 5.1 material with same settings.

You're right, the about box says "decoder capabilities 6 channels". Maybe they are counting the main channels? And I "only" hear 6.1. and not 7.1? I honestly can't tell. Maybe it is simply wrong? Wouldn't be the only "wrong" thing with this program. PDVD7 always could decode DTS-ES 6.1.
The same disc contains DTS-ES 6.1 tracks, and back surround works fine.

Well believe me, PDVD7 can only decode 6 channels. DTS-ES 6.1 (Matrix) is a different thing because the 7th channel is calculated out of the rear 2 and is not a true discrete channel.

Anyway, PDVD8 now has true discrete 8 channel support and I love it.
Unfortunately these morons took away the HD-DVD support...

 

[James]

Well believe me, PDVD7 can only decode 6 channels. DTS-ES 6.1 (Matrix) is a different thing because the 7th channel is calculated out of the rear 2 and is not a true discrete channel.

There is DTS-ES 6.1 discrete, isn't there?

 

[James]

Well believe me, PDVD7 can only decode 6 channels. DTS-ES 6.1 (Matrix) is a different thing because the 7th channel is calculated out of the rear 2 and is not a true discrete channel.

Anyway, PDVD8 now has true discrete 8 channel support and I love it.
Unfortunately these morons took away the HD-DVD support...

Anyway, I'll order the PDVD8 update, so I can probably tell the difference.

 

[XxDeadlyxX]

Well for 7.1 MA tracks, PDVD7 always said 5.1 in the info window... but for 3:10 to Yuma it said PCM 7.1 in the info. Not sure if it could actually output 7.1 PCM though.

 

[andy o]

DTS-HD and DTS-HD MA basically have the same architecture. Both have a DTS 5.1 or in some cases Embedded 6.1 core. Both have an HD-Extension and can have a 96 or even 192 kHz-extension. The main (only?) difference between HD and HD MA is that HD is "only" CBR whereas HD MA is "VBR".

Yeah, that seems to support what I've been saying, that DTS-HD MA has a DTS core, DTS-HD has a DTS core, but you can't extract regular, CBR, lossy DTS-HD from DTS-HD MA.

So, going back to the original subject that prompted this discussion (that if you can hear 7.1 from a DTS-HD MA track, MA is actually being decoded, since the "core" is only 5.1 in all known movies and at most it could be 6.1), I think that assertion still stands.

About PowerDVD 7.3 having 7.1 decoding, I thought that it did for TrueHD and LPCM, but I don't have a 7.1 speaker setup (I do, but it's a drag to connect them rear speakers just for a handful of movies in my tiny apartment).

By the way, is there a commercially available test disc for these sound formats?

 

[James]

Well for 7.1 MA tracks, PDVD7 always said 5.1 in the info window... but for 3:10 to Yuma it said PCM 7.1 in the info. Not sure if it could actually output 7.1 PCM though.

Oh, it certainly outputs 7.1 from LPCM tracks. No big deal, it doesn't need to decode anything.

 

[James]

Yeah, that seems to support what I've been saying, that DTS-HD MA has a DTS core, DTS-HD has a DTS core, but you can't extract regular, CBR, lossy DTS-HD from DTS-HD MA.

So, going back to the original subject that prompted this discussion (that if you can hear 7.1 from a DTS-HD MA track, MA is actually being decoded, since the "core" is only 5.1 in all known movies and at most it could be 6.1), I think that assertion still stands.

I believe you are correct.

About PowerDVD 7.3 having 7.1 decoding, I thought that it did for TrueHD and LPCM, but I don't have a 7.1 speaker setup (I do, but it's a drag to connect them rear speakers just for a handful of movies in my tiny apartment).

It certainly does for LPCM. I don't know any discs with 7.1 TrueHD (or 7.1 DD plus), so I can't test. If you know a title, let me know, chances are, that I have it.

I still believe it *does* decode 7.1 DTS-HD (not only the 5.1 "core"). It does not decode DTS-HD MA (only the core), that's why you'll get 5.1 output from a 7.1 DTS HD MA track.

 

[XxDeadlyxX]

Something I noticed.. it seems Cyberlink put in some code in PDVD8 for running it with PDVD7... if you open PDVD7 and then try and open PDVD8, it pops up saying "A previous version of Cyberlink PowerDVD is currently running. You must close it before running Cyberlink PowerDVD 8". Then it seems to automatically close PDVD7 and open PDVD8.

 

[XxDeadlyxX]

Just got Hostage Region B import, the back cover says DTS-HD Master Audio 5.1, but it's a misprint as PowerDVD says "DTS-HD High Resolution 5.1". Good to see PowerDVD information reading that correctly now too.

 

[wnmnkh]

So..... I am sorry for newbie post. But what's the difference between PowerDVD 7 Ultra and PowerDVD 8 Ultra ? I just cannot find any difference.

Edit : well, I eventually read all of the posts here and found out. Disregard my post please.

 

[spcav]

I don't know any discs with 7.1 TrueHD (or 7.1 DD plus), so I can't test. If you know a title, let me know, chances are, that I have it.

http://www.demo-world.eu/news/index...e-Sound-Of-High-Definition-Blu-RayHD-DVD.html

 

[SuperGoof]

This site has, among others, statistics on audio formats used by Blu-ray titles.

http://www.blu-raystats.com/stats.php

 

[Roger O]

There is

So..... I am sorry for newbie post. But what's the difference between PowerDVD 7 Ultra and PowerDVD 8 Ultra ? I just cannot find any difference.

Edit : well, I eventually read all of the posts here and found out. Disregard my post please.

There is a major difference but not in quality on or performance. Both versions suck especially version 8. You can no longer play anything from hard drive with version 8 other then DVD. Don’t waste your money on either version. If they were so worried about copyright issues then the option to play anything from any source other then CD should have been removed. There are decent alternative players out there now that support hard drive playback and still support HD. Millions of people have HD movies and this is one option alone that should have never been removed for at least 2 more years.

 

[andy o]

There is DTS-ES 6.1 discrete, isn't there?

I missed this one. Yes, there is and with the DTS-ES DVD's I've tried (Lord of the Rings Extended editions) the 6th channel is alive and kicking. Don't know if there would be a difference with HD discs though, but I don't think so. I still thinks it depends on the format.

 

[w1seman]

I missed this one. Yes, there is and with the DTS-ES DVD's I've tried (Lord of the Rings Extended editions) the 6th channel is alive and kicking. Don't know if there would be a difference with HD discs though, but I don't think so. I still thinks it depends on the format.

DTS doesn't often have a discrete channel for LFE, its calculated from the other channels.

DTS's LFE channel is a little different. In fact, in the cinema, DTS is actually 5.0 (as oppose to 5.1) in that there is no discrete LFE channel. The LFE channel from the mixing sessions gets low-passed at 80 Hz and added to the surround channels.

Source: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_7_2/feature-article-misunderstood-lfe-channel-april-2000.html

Therefore PDVD7 can of course decode 6.1 DTS-ES.

PDVD7 imho doens't have more than 6 discrete channels for decoding.

 

[andy o]

DTS doesn't have a discrete channel for LFE, its calculated from the other channels.

I was talking about the 6th full-frequency channel, as in the rear back one. It is discrete indeed. There are two, DTS-ES 6.1 discrete and DTS-ES Matrix. It is right on the DTS website, and here in more detail. The matrixed channel is always present in the Ls and Rs, but in the case of 6.1 there is also a discrete back, and with a DTS-ES 6.1 discrete decoder you can play that discrete channel, and subtract the already redundant matrixed channel from the Ls and Rs. Dolby Digital EX is the one that is only matrixed.

But about the non-discrete LFE channel on DTS:

Source: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_7_2/feature-article-misunderstood-lfe-channel-april-2000.html

You missed this tidbit right after what you quoted (which incidentally also says the same thing)

DTS's LFE channel in consumer applications, unlike its cinema counterpart, is discrete but still has a few 'special' considerations.[...]

Therefore PDVD7 can of course decode 6.1 DTS-ES.

PDVD7 doens't have more than 6 discrete channels for decoding.

First sentence is correct (without the "therefore"), but second sentence is not, from my experience with DTS-ES discrete movies and my 6.1 speaker system.