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Blocked BD copy playback (Cinavia)

I did say they probably already have. They are obviously intelligent :p

Guys, you have obviously misunderstood. So, I'm gonna shut up, and keep my opinions to myself. An argument is not what I was after. So clearly I was misunderstood.

I say something was overlooked, because I have not read about what I'm aware of by any other thread(Logic requires little definitive knowledge). I didn't say slysoft overlooked anything. I did say NOBODY knows how simple this could be, but perhaps that was the wrong statment :p
 
Actually people who have knowledge of what is involved, people with extensive audio electronics experience, have said more than once cinavia is NOT simple; no ifs, ands, or buts.
 
Wow. Might as well just throw in the towel guys. It's the end of the world.
:) :) :) is that enough smileys???

A protection that succeeds all others.

Lets give up on faster than light speed travel too. It's so unlikely, it'll probably never happen :p
 
Who said people have given up circumventing cinavia? Slysoft sure hasn't given up, it is an announced, planned future feature of Slyce.
 
FurryGuy said:
Who said people have given up circumventing cinavia? Slysoft sure hasn't given up, it is an announced, planned future feature of Slyce.
Click to expand...

Please forgive me, it's the way you came across in your last post. You said nothing about giving up, you merely stated it's not simple. Which it could be. Some people can multiply triple digits in their head quickly. Others require a great deal of focus, or they're simply incapable.

I sure hope this isn't misunderstood.

Cinavia will either be patched, or removed(removal without affecting audio quality however would be unlikely at our day in age).
 
omegaman7 said:
you merely stated it's not simple. Which it could be.
Click to expand...

People with direct knowledge of what is involved have said it is not simple.

If you think you know better then create your own solution and make a lot of money.
 
FurryGuy said:
People with direct knowledge of what is involved have said it is not simple.

If you think you know better then create your own solution and make a lot of money.
Click to expand...

Money is the route/root of all evil :p
 
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omegaman7 said:
Please forgive me, it's the way you came across in your last post. You said nothing about giving up, you merely stated it's not simple. Which it could be. Some people can multiply triple digits in their head quickly. Others require a great deal of focus, or they're simply incapable.

I sure hope this isn't misunderstood.

Cinavia will either be patched, or removed(removal without affecting audio quality however would be unlikely at our day in age).
Click to expand...
You should definitely stick to delivering parcels (as your profile says), and leave the computer programming job to the professionals. You don't have a clue about what you're talking about, or you're just trolling here now.
 
Alright, enough of the bickering. I don't mind a friendly discussion, but, if it devolves any further I'll have to get involved. Don't make me put my mod hat on.....I really don't like to. Consider this a friendly warning to keep it civil. :policeman:
 
Have I been uncivil? If I have, I apologize to the entire thread. I think I've simply been misunderstood. I merely state opinions, and educated guesses.

A troll is something I try to shy away from :p

Delivering parcels part time, allows me to educate myself in my free time. I have a lot of it, when I'm not working my second job :D

I will post nothing more off topic. I will post only my beliefs about Cinavia, and Logical possibilities therein.
 
I've been lurking around this thread for a few months, seeing if anyone has come up with a work-around for Cinavia yet.

Seems not to be the case. It is certainly proving to be a robust watermark!

Anyhow, from various opinions across the internet it looks like one of the popular ideas is that it is using some sort of echo encoding where the original signal is delayed by a short time (short enough to be deemed 'inaudible') with differing time delays forming a 'bit' of data as it seems that Cinavia encodes binary information. This is a scheme that Verance used in DVD-Audio (http://patents.justia.com/2002/06430301.html)

This seems plausible, but also should be able to be detected fairly easily using auto correlation techniques. (When I install MATLAB on my home machine I plan to look into this).

An alternate idea that I thought of after reading the Cinavia FAQ (www.verance.com/pdf/Cinavia_FAQs.pdf)...

They mention
Cinavia employs modern communication techniques like those used by mobile phones to be able to reliably operate even when the noise from compression technologies is present.
Click to expand...

This could suggest they are using spread spectrum signalling techniques. These techniques can be used to encode low data rate signals with so much processing gain that they can be detected with negative SNR. This way the signal (Cinavia) can hide in amongst the noise (soundtrack) without visual detection (ie spectrograph). It is only when correlated with the original spreading sequence that the 'signal' exposes itself, and if you don't know that sequence it can be bloody difficult (impossible) to detect.

The other limitation that the watermark has, is that it needs to be pretty efficient to decode. Verance sell decoding software that requires an old P3 and 256MB ram. Also it needs to be able to run on Blu-ray players and other similar hardware where computing power would be at a premium. Requiring 100MHz of CPU for a DRM system would be a little bit rude.
 
There are limits

omegaman7 said:
I've heard "it won't be updated to handle it"...

Anydvd may not be updated to handle it, but it could.
Click to expand...

No it could NOT. AnyDVD as a driver is NOT able to alter anything like this in the container. Slyce eventually will have a shot at this but not AnyDVD.
 
Possible...

...but it requires a PhD in Physics / signal processing.
 
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Can anyone confirm that Cyberlink PowerDVD 12.02118a.57 (current latest version) has Cinavia implemented within the player/software?
I tried playing "The Campaign" & "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo" backup BD copies on it and didn’t get the message. Not sure why, it should have thu! I get the message on the PS3 on both movies.
I was wondering if anyone here did indeed get the message on the PC (Using PowerDVD 12). According to Cyberlink, this version should already have Cinavia detection within.

The reason I am asking, I would like to run some testing by doing some memory dumps and further investigate some of the triggering mechanisms within PowerDVD.
My first goal is to accelerate the triggering mechanism to be much less than 20 minutes. Would make stuff a lil easier/faster to debug.

They threw us a bone now by putting it on PC software which is “easier” to reverse engineer than proprietary firmware such as on the PS3 or certain Blu-ray players.
Let me know please...

P.S:
I have these Services (related to PowerDVD) disabled on my Windows box, because they are crap and useless:

CLHNServiceForPowerDVD12
CyberLink PowerDVD 12 Media Server Monitor Service
CyberLink PowerDVD 12 Media Server Service

** When you have these services disabled, PowerDVD will cry about Media Server thingy when you open it, I just click X to close that message!

Not sure if by disabling these services, is the reason why the Cinavia is not triggered on my 2 test movies but I doubt it. Hence my message asking poeple to test.

Thanks again! Please report your findings here. :)
 
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I'd help you out, but it seems that not a single Blu-Ray in my collection has Cinavia, and I've looked on several lists on the web.
I'm kinda surprised big releases like Prometheus don't have it by the way... and there are a lot of utterly crappy movies on the list too.

You know you have to wait 20+ minutes before the message appears, right?
 
Korrigan said:
I'd help you out, but it seems that not a single Blu-Ray in my collection has Cinavia, and I've looked on several lists on the web.
I'm kinda surprised big releases like Prometheus don't have it by the way... and there are a lot of utterly crappy movies on the list too.

You know you have to wait 20+ minutes before the message appears, right?
Click to expand...

I've found over the years, it's fairly typical for low budget movies to have high new/encryption. What's funny is, encryption costs money. So this is odd, eh? Certainly just my own observations. Obviously disney seems to update with almost every new movie(Disney being Generally good about releasing agreeable movies). At least it used to be that way.

At the moment, it's mostly $ony that uses Cinavia. There are select few from Warner, etc though.
 
Disney has join the camp as well. First movie protected by cinavia and from disney is "Frankenweenie" also include 3D version.

DVD version also inlude cinavia in to release.
 
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