AI Scanner

[fordman]

The funny thing is - according to the log, AI Scanner doesn't touch VTS12 at all....

Hmmm. Well obviously you are the expert, but I assure you that it does indeed truncate the file, and the competitor's program does not. Then again, the other program leaves VTS_13 in the ripped version, though it caused no problems in burning. That program found that it's "pathplayer" was not necessary, so that's probably why it didn't negatively impact any of the files.

I opened the zip file and started examining the "AnyDVD_log.txt" file, and it shows the following:

VTS_12_1.VOB (Title-VOB 4056535 - 4070833)

Used:
4056535 - 4070722 (14188 )

Unused:
4070723 - 4070833 (111)

So, the total sectors equates to 29,282,304 bytes
and the used sectors equates to 29,054,976 bytes

Are the "unused" sectors normally truncated by AnyDVD? If so, then it would appear that AnyDVD would touch VTS_12_1.VOB, but it is overdoing it?

I'm going to upload the log file made with 6.3.0.2 tonight. This was made on a new laptop running Windows Vista, while this zip log was made on a desktop running Windows XP Pro SP2. However, since the file sizes look identical, I don't know that it will yield any more info, other than a second data point. It would be optimal if someone else with this disc can report the results of their ripped files... The original disc plays fine, as does the one made from the ripped files from the other ripping program, so I'm confident that it has nothing to do with my original...

 

[James]

Hmmm. Well obviously you are the expert, but I assure you that it does indeed truncate the file, and the competitor's program does not.

I don't consider "the other" program competition.
Beware, CloneDVD2 & Co. (correctly) renumber / reorder title set numbers. VTS12 might not be called VTS12 anymore.
The correct test is (as always...): PLAY the original disc on your PC with AnyDVD enabled (AnyDVD's main purpose, by the way).

If this plays correctly, AI Scanner worked correctly and the problem is elsewhere (CloneDVD / AnyDVD ripper). Would be interesting to know...

 

[lostinlodos]

Looks like according to Rewind there are two versions of R1: Ratatouille; one with the three "easter eggs" and one without. The one I bought at Fry's is probably the same no-specials version listed as Membership Version on Rewind, the kind you get from Columbia House and DVD Super Club, and the like.

 

[fordman]

I don't consider "the other" program competition.
Beware, CloneDVD2 & Co. (correctly) renumber / reorder title set numbers. VTS12 might not be called VTS12 anymore.
The correct test is (as always...): PLAY the original disc on your PC with AnyDVD enabled (AnyDVD's main purpose, by the way).

If this plays correctly, AI Scanner worked correctly and the problem is elsewhere (CloneDVD / AnyDVD ripper). Would be interesting to know...

OK, James, I have the info you requested, and more. By the way, I've posted the zipped logs in the following thread were Webslinger requested it:
http://forum.slysoft.com/showthread.php?t=11040&page=2

1. Yes, I'm aware that CloneDVD can renumber titles. In this case the title numbers are the same as the originals, but VTS_13 is removed (bogus apparently). This was also easy enough to verify by simply double-clicking the individual VOB files, which are associated with PowerDVD on my systems. By doing his I can watch the original VTS_12_1.VOB file play to completion, including the video that goes along with all the speaker tests. Meanwhile, after doing the same with the ripped VTS_12_1.VOB file, I watch it terminate after it tests the first speaker. It's reached the end of the file at this point.

2. I did a CRC check of the AnyDVD ripped files against those ripped by CloneDVD, and ALL are identical, including the IFOs and BUPs. That's good to know. I may just skip using CloneDVD when burning to DL media from now on. The thing to note here is that VTS_12_1.VOB is truncated from 29 MB to 6 MB.

3. I followed your request and just played the original with AnyDVD running in the background. YES, it PLAYS CORRECTLY! Looks indeed like there is a problem in both the standalone CloneDVD engine AND the version of it built into AnyDVD Ripper, as you suggested!

4. So, I decided to try another experiment - I simply copied all the files with Windows Explorer with AnyDVD running in the background. The result: All files copied to the hard drive and have the EXACT same size as that shown on the original when AnyDVD is running. As a matter of a fact, the bogus VTS_13 titleset is copied and the other titlesets are not truncated, which I assume means that the invalid call pieces and bad sectors are NOT removed. I'm guessing that's what the so-called "competing program" is doing, as it's output had the bogus VTS_13 titleset and it stated that it was disabling pathplayer.

So, now that it seems that you have indeed traced the issue to the CloneDVD code, what is our recourse for ensuring that we get good copies? Should we just copy in Windows Explorer and then attempt to clean up the ripped files with a program like PGCEdit?

Though the titleset in on this particular DVD isn't a very important one, just the fact that it happens makes one wary that the same bug in the CloneDVD code could cause issues on future DVD titles, with possibly more serious consequence...

I love AnyDVD and have enjoyed using it with the Elby programs you market. However, now that AnyDVD Ripper is based on their (apparently buggy) CloneDVD code, it appears that it has compromised your program. I also agree with you that AnyDVD is superior to the so-called competition, and in this instance that other program was likely just performing the equivalent of the Windows Explorer Copy that I did with AnyDVD. So again, the issue will remain on how to get the advantage of the structure cleaning that CloneDVD or AnyDVD Ripper provides without removing valid parts of the DVD?

Thanks for taking this seriously. I'm willing to help with any future testing if it will help you improve AnyDVD...

fordman

 

[fordman]

Please upload the .zip file using Anydvd 6.3.0.2:

OK, the .zip file is attached. Also check out my reply to James in this thread:

http://forum.slysoft.com/showpost.php?p=74238&postcount=11

As James suggested, it appears there's an issue with the CloneDVD code built into the full CloneDVD or the CloneDVD engine that AnyDVD Ripper uses! Now we're getting somewhere...

 

[fordman]

Looks like according to Rewind there are two versions of R1: Ratatouille; one with the three "easter eggs" and one without. The one I bought at Fry's is probably the same no-specials version listed as Membership Version on Rewind, the kind you get from Columbia House and DVD Super Club, and the like.

Ahhh, I see. I didn't realize there were stripped versions marketed to/by DVD membership distributors. I can confirm that I have the version with the Easter eggs, which can be accessed by highlighting the pots in the kitchen...

 

[Webslinger]

OK, the .zip file is attached.

NTIDrvr (system32\DRIVERS\NTIDrvr.sys), Version: 1.0.0.6 (1.0.0.6)
Company: NewTech Infosystems, Inc.
Copyright: Copyright (C) 2002 NewTech Infosystems, Inc.
Description: NTI CD-ROM Filter Driver
FileVersion: 1, 0, 0, 6
ProductVersion: 1, 0, 0, 6

I recommend you uninstall NTI's Filecd, as it may be causing conflicts.

It's important that NTIdrvr no longer appears in your filters.


If you can't figure out how to remove (or uninstall that program) that filter (or how to check your filters), do this:

i) Create a backup of your registry
ii) Download imgburn. It's a free program: http://www.imgburn.com/index.php?act=download
(it's also an excellent program imo)
iii) Go to Tools > Filter Driver Load Order. Select "NTIDrvr". Click "Remove Selected Filter". Click "ok".
iv) Reboot


While I'm not convinced that is the root of the issue, I prefer to eliminate possible causes.

 

[James]

Though the titleset in on this particular DVD isn't a very important one, just the fact that it happens makes one wary that the same bug in the CloneDVD code could cause issues on future DVD titles, with possibly more serious consequence...

Highly unlikely. It didn't happen on - how many? 10000? 100000 titles? Anyway, it looks there is a problem with the CloneDVD code, so it will be fixed. Disc is in the mail, I hope I'll get the correct one.

 

[fordman]

Highly unlikely. It didn't happen on - how many? 10000? 100000 titles? Anyway, it looks there is a problem with the CloneDVD code, so it will be fixed. Disc is in the mail, I hope I'll get the correct one.

I suppose you mean that it hasn't truncated only part of a titleset? Otherwise, I recall seeing several instances in the release notes where the AI scanner was updated because it was removing entire titlesets or menus on a particular DVD. However, since we are speaking about CloneDVD code here, then that may be comparing apples to oranges.

I've noticed that there are less instances of the unintended titleset removal with the current betas, so the AI Scanner is indeed maturing. If one can be sure that any such occurence in the future would only result in an entire titleset being removed, that would at least be easier to verify than having to play each titleset all the way through.

It does seem like a somewhat isolated occurrence at this point. The fact that the very next titleset (bogus) was removed made me suspicous that the removal was "bleeding over" into a valid titleset, but I'm sure that the CloneDVD programmers will be able to determine that.

As far as getting the right version, let me know if you do not, either by PM here or by e-mail, and I may be able to help. As long as it came from a standard retail chain and not from one of those clubs that lostinlodos referenced, you should be OK.

I am going to experiment more with just using Windows Explorer, and then cleaning up the ripped files with PGCEdit. In my experience, it's pretty good at locating unused PGCs/titles, and will delete them and all reference to them in the IFO/BUP files. I suppose I could even run fixVTS through the ripped files, though I've seen it corrupt VOBs in the past, and that was observed by some other users also.

Thanks again,
fordman

 

[fordman]

I recommend you uninstall NTI's Filecd, as it may be causing conflicts.

It's important that NTIdrvr no longer appears in your filters.

.
. <instructions removed>
.

While I'm not convinced that is the root of the issue, I prefer to eliminate possible causes.

Hello Webslinger. I see that the thread referencing issues with 6.3.0.2 beta has been merged with this "AI Scanner" thread.

Based on what James and I found through his suggestions, it is apparent that there is no issue with the NTI driver, especially when one considers that fact that I encountered the exact same results when using 6.3.0.1 on a different computer that has no NTI software at all, and I posted that ZIP file also.

Given that it plays fine with AnyDVD running on each computer and will copy to the hard drive with Windows Explorer, that is further proof that the problem does not lie in AnyDVD/AI Scanner itself, but rather the CloneDVD code.

So, I'll not bother to uninstall the NTI software or remove the driver at this point. The new laptop came with it pre-installed without any backup media, though I was able to make an archive type backup from a recovery program that it provided. So, it would be extremely painful to try to re-install the program.

I do recall messing with regedit to remove upper and lower filters a while back, so if I can again locate the positions in the registry, perhaps I can export the key before deleting the key, and then merge it back into the registry when I'm done experimenting....I'll look into it.

 

[Webslinger]

Hello Webslinger. I see that the thread referencing issues with 6.3.0.2 beta has been merged with this "AI Scanner" thread.

Yeah, I didn't want to have to look into different locations for this specific disc issue. Makes things confusing

Based on what James and I found through his suggestions, it is apparent that there is no issue with the NTI driver

I agree that the issue with respect to the disc is unlikely to be affected by the NTI driver. However, it is possible a conflict may occur in the future; the driver does appear to act in a similar fashion to packet writing software drivers.

I do recall messing with regedit to removed upper and lower filters a while back, so if I can again locate the positions in the registry, perhaps I can export the key before deleting the key, and then merge it back into the registry when I'm done experimenting....I'll look into it.

1. Open regedit (Start > Run > Type "Regedit")
2. Go to
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Class\{4D36E965-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318

 

[fordman]

I agree that the issue with respect to the disc is unlikely to be affected by the NTI driver. However, it is possible a conflict may occur in the future; the driver does appear to act in a similar fashion to packet writing software drivers.

Oh, then I agree wholeheartedly - the first thing I usually do is get rid of any packetwriting software like DirectCD (Roxio), Drive Letter Access (Sonic) or InCD (Nero). Though I never had issues with it interfering with other CD apps, I have found that the discs are usually unreadable after several writes, and then I have to use something like ISOBuster to get the data off. I abandoned packet writing years ago, and just choose to do multisession recording instead. Usually a program will allow one to just uninstall the packet writing portion, but if not, I'll disable the filter.

1. Open regedit (Start > Run > Type "Regedit")
2. Go to
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Class\{4D36E965-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318

I was just searching through my registry at my work computer when I saw your reply. I found this key along with other "ControlSet" keys like:

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet003\Control\Class\{4D36E965-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}

Would I need to delete reference in those keys also?

Thanks for the assistance.

 

[Webslinger]

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet003\Control\Class\{4D36E965-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}

Would I need to delete reference in those keys also?

I believe the important entry is found under "CurrentControlset"

After removing the NTIdrv entry from your upperfilter, doublecheck with imgburn that that filter no longer appears to be listed. If it doesn't, then the answer to your question is "no".

 

[fordman]

I believe the important entry is found under "CurrentControlset"

After removing the NTIdrv entry from your upperfilter, doublecheck with imgburn that that filter no longer appears to be listed. If it doesn't, then the answer to your question is "no".

OK, I did this and only the CurrentControlSet one needed to be deleted. It's no longer there according to ImgBurn.

After installing 6.3.0.3 and rebooting, I re-ripped Ratatouille with AnyDVD Ripper and got the same results, a truncated VTS_12_1.VOB. I've attached the most current zip file.

So, we'll have to wait to see what can be done with the CloneDVD code.

I tried to fix the files copied with Windows Explorer using PGCEdit, and the remnants of the protection just caused too many issues - NAV Pack warnings, etc. And in the end, I could not choose the same layer break point as the original had, presumably because the bogus excess hadn't been trimmed (thought PGCEdit did get rid of the relatively small VTS_13 titleset.

So, until this is fixed, the competing program worked well (no NAV Pack warnings, kept all content), and got rid of enough bad sector content, etc., that I could select the same layer break position as the original...