Just what is AnyDVD ripper

[SuperGoof]

What I'm not aware of is whether using clonedvd to process a video_ts folder that was dragged and dropped off the original disc onto, say, your desktop will produce the exact same result as using clonedvd to rip from the original disc (especially heavily protected discs). And that's what Supergoof is asking; I don't believe the question has anything to do with Clonecd.

Thank you both for very interesting discussion.

You understood my question correct. When I was saying "1:1 copy" I did not mean bit by bit copy. I meant functionaly equivalent copy: with all menus, titles, audio and subtitle tracks and so on. I don't care about layer break either (thought information about it should be in one of .IFO files as far as understand, at least after grag and drop).

Currently I play my DVDs with "Mediagate MG-350HD" multimedia player connected to my home network. I shared DVD drive on my laptop, and when AnyDVD is enabled, "Mediagate" is able to play VIDEO_TS folder on that network share. It upscales to 1080i too. Also I can select NTSC/PAL (which at 1080i means 60/50Hz) depending on disc.

Yesterday I bought "Pursuit of Happyness" and "DejaVu" Region 4 DVDs, and "Mediagate" seems to play them just fine. So if I copy them to hard drive, it will not make any difference, I assume.

 

[Webslinger]

I meant functionaly equivalent copy: with all menus, titles, audio and subtitle tracks and so on.

Then the answer *should* be yes.

(thought information about it should be in one of .IFO files as far as understand, at least after grag and drop).

No. It's not.

Yesterday I bought "Pursuit of Happyness" and "DejaVu" Region 4 DVDs, and "Mediagate" seems to play them just fine. So if I copy them to hard drive, it will not make any difference, I assume.

With the newer Sony/Lionsgate releases, it would make far more sense to rip with Clonedvd than dragging and dropping.

This is the best way to rip with Anydvd

 

[calweycn]

If you're using CloneCD to do a 1:1 copy, it will keep the DVD structure the same as on the original. This means that if your player has problems playing the original, you're LIKELY to have problems playing a 1:1 copy. CloneDVD(or the AnyDVD ripper) could be used, in this case, to remove all traces of the structure protection before burning to a DL disc. However, you lose the original layer break by doing that. So, there's no flawless solution...personally, in these cases, I'd rather lose the layer break than keep the structural protection...

You can always use ImgBurn to put the layer break in the same cell as on the original. I also make it seamless. You have to load the disc with PGC Edit (and AnyDVD) to see what cell is used for the layer break. This is not too hard, but there is a slight learning curve for PGC Edit. Some DVDs have a seamless layer break, so it's hard to tell where the LB is. It's usually a cell between chapters. You might be able to find a better layer break position.

 

[calweycn]

I'm a bit of a stickler about preserving the original layer break position.

Sometimes you can select a better layer break with ImgBurn, esp if you blank unwanted material and/or audio streams. This gives you more layer breaks to choose from. Sometimes the layer break can be placed better without editing the files at all. It also works better, IMO, to use seamless break. I don't think CloneDVD allows seamless LB, which is one reason I use ImgBurn.

 

[Webslinger]

Sometimes you can select a better layer break with ImgBurn, esp if you blank unwanted material and/or audio streams.

Yeah, I don't. That smacks of effort.

I use to use imgburn, but not often anymore. And I got tired of editing.

I don't think CloneDVD allows seamless LB

It doesn't. And I burn on the fly (which I don't recommend doing because most people end up with inferior burn quality) with Clonecd; No ripping; no waiting around; and the original layer break position is preserved.

 

[calweycn]

And I burn on the fly (which I don't recommend doing because most people end up with inferior burn quality) with Clonecd; No ripping; no waiting around; and the original layer break position is preserved.

I want something better than the original if I'm going to burn a dual layer disc. That means blanking the annoying previews and warnings, stripping audio and subtitles I don't want, disabling useless menu buttons, and making a seamless layer break. I also edit the subtitles occasionally, like removing closed caption subtitles from foreign movies. DVD Sub Edit makes that easy most of the time. For me, it's fun to play with programs like PGC Edit. I used to just rip and burn images, but got tired of all the crud on DVDs.

 

[Webslinger]

I want something better than the original if I'm going to burn a dual layer disc. That means blanking the annoying previews and warnings, stripping audio and subtitles I don't want, disabling useless menu buttons, and making a seamless layer break. I also edit the subtitles occasionally, like removing closed caption subtitles from foreign movies. DVD Sub Edit makes that easy most of the time. For me, it's fun to play with programs like PGC Edit. I used to just rip and burn images, but got tired of all the crud on DVDs.

Yeah, that's understandable. I use to do the same stuff. But I'm impatient and lazy.

Lots of people like to edit.

 

[SamuriHL]

I'll edit to a point. VobBlanker, PGCEdit, etc make it fairly painless. (Speaking of, PGCEdit 8.2 is released in case you missed it) *MOST* of the time I just like to remove whole titlesets which CloneDVD makes quite simple. I've not tried positioning a layer break with IMGBurn but when I get some more DL discs I may give it a try.

 

[DrinkLyeAndDie]

[OT]

Speaking of, PGCEdit 8.2 is released in case you missed it

Bleh. You beat me to it! I forgot to post about this yesterday.

I still am too much of an idiot to really use the program though. :doh:

[/OT]

 

[linx05]

[OT]



Bleh. You beat me to it! I forgot to post about this yesterday.

I still am too much of an idiot to really use the program though. :doh:

[/OT]

PgcEdit use to scare me. I got into VobBlanker then moved on to PgcEdit when I wanted more control over specific things. I love the little bugger. I even donated to the author.

 

[SamuriHL]

Don't let it scare you. First off, anything you do can be undone. Second, it's a VERY powerful editor. The ability to follow PGC's alone makes it worth learning. Just follow the guides on his site and you'll quickly start to get familiar with it. Also, remember that if you eliminate a PGC playback, you'll want to run it through FixVTS or VobBlanker after to get rid of the unreferenced material. But definitely don't be afraid of it...it's very handy.

 

[synthe]

Bit-identical copies with ImgBurn?

Hi all,

At the risk of reviving a dead thread, or having missed some other more relevant post elsewhere in the forums, I wonder if anyone might share their tips or setup on how to get bit-identical copies of DVDs, including CSS data, etc.

On a lark, I made an ISO image from a disc, with AnyDVD loaded and enabled, using ImgBurn and the results (as determined by comparing the information displayed for both the source disc and the ISO image -- mounted as a DVD with Virtual CloneDrive -- found in AnyDVD's Status display) were what I expected. The ISO image had no CSS data or region encoding.

Then, with AnyDVD loaded but disabled, and again writing an ISO image of the disc and mounting it with Virtual CloneDrive, I was somewhat surprised to find that the ISO image had no CSS data or region encoding. Interesting!

Is this because AnyDVD is loaded, even though it's disabled? Would uninstalling AnyDVD and then creating an image with ImgBurn give me bit-identical copies? What does disabling AnyDVD actually do?

I've read elsewhere (such as in this thread) that CloneCD will make a "1:1" copy, but also defeats copy protection (for CDs at least), so I'm not sure what "1:1" means. I'm looking for bit-identical copies (for esoteric reasons; I'm familiar with "functionally identical" and more practical copy methods, such as those discussed earlier, including transcoding with CloneDVD, etc.) if possible.

Thanks in advance for any tips, pointers, or corrections.

 

[Whisperer]

... I'm looking for bit-identical copies ... if possible.

synthe,
Not possible. You cannot make a backup of an original without using a decryptor (like AnyDVD) for neutralizing/removing CSS and Region Encoding, removing invalid VOBUs and Bad sector protections, rearranging purposefully bad DVD structure protections etc. So by definition, the ability to even make your backup requires altering of the original. The term "a 1:1 copy" (of the original), as it is used in referrence to making backups, simply means all video, audio & ROM elements of the movie are retained and no data is thrown away via compression. CloneCD is the best Slysoft product for this.

Your quest is for naught. If you don't mind me asking, why do you feel the need to create "bit-identical" copies? All you need to do is create is a playable backup to protect your personal DVD collection purchase investment.

... I was somewhat surprised to find that the ISO image had no CSS data or region encoding. Interesting! ...

Interesting perhaps but this is merely & exactly what AnyDVD is meant to do and does.

Best regards,
Whisperer

 

[synthe]

Thanks for your reply Whisperer.

You cannot make a backup of an original without using a decryptor (like AnyDVD) for neutralizing/removing CSS and Region Encoding, removing invalid VOBUs and Bad sector protections, rearranging purposefully bad DVD structure protections etc. So by definition, the ability to even make your backup requires altering of the original.

This is what I suspected, though I was curious to see if it might be possible with standard commercial off-the-shelf hardware and commodity PCs. I don't know a lot with regards to CSS and other DVD and CD copy protection schemes compared to many on these forums, but I know a little in general about copy protection and hardware/software interfaces (e.g. drivers) and I theorized that bit-identical copies might be hard to make because, as I understand it, CSS can be and is used to authenticate discs to players in order for data to be read from them. I suspect most DVD-ROM drives respect CSS (maybe at the drive's firmware level, but possibly also or at least at the OS driver level) when asked to read a DVD encoded with it, though I'm still a little unclear on two seemingly feasible cases:

1. Wouldn't software like IsoBuster be able to read a CSS-protected disc and write each byte to disk unmodified, without understanding anything of the target disc's copy protection?
   
2. Similarly, what about block-level copying software like dd under Unix or Linux systems?

I admit I haven't done enough research here, and I'm relying on certain assumptions that may not be right, but it would seem to be one of two cases:

1. Either "standard" from-the-vendor DVD-ROM drives have firmware-level and/or driver-level support for CSS and will not read a disc encrypted with CSS without completing CSS authentication first, or
   
2. CSS support is entirely dependent on the program reading from the drive via whatever interface, the same bits go across the wire to every program, and it's up to that program to make sense of the data (e.g. if a software DVD player, implement CSS and present the unencrypted data to the user).

In the first case, the options to bypass CSS include cracking the CSS key, patching the driver (if there's no firmware level support), and/or patching the firmware of the drive. In the second case, I can use low-level block-copying software because I expressly don't want to decode CSS or otherwise modify the bitstream.

If you don't mind me asking, why do you feel the need to create "bit-identical" copies?

I know I don't need to for practical purposes, this is more of a question of "how close to perfect can I archive copy protected data".

Interesting perhaps but this is merely & exactly what AnyDVD is meant to do and does.

Oh no, agreed! I was merely asking why this is still the case when AnyDVD is disabled; i.e. what AnyDVD features are actually controlled by enabling or disabling AnyDVD?

Thanks again!

 

[linx05]

The copy protection, once removed properly, will not cause any harm with the DVD playback. As long as you use good media and burn at a reasonable speed you will have a perfect backed up DVD.

You don't need to worry about removing CSS. You will have no problems playing a DVD with or without CSS. Why would they make writeable DVDs if you could only play DVDs with CSS?

 

[Kalkas]

as James has said, theres no need for it if you use clonedvd

The ripper has been recently changed to use the same code as CloneDVD. If you have CloneDVD, it's ALWAYS recommended to use it to rip as it gives you far more control over what titlesets, languages, and subtitles to keep/discard when ripping. Even if you plan on compressing the title with another program, ripping with CloneDVD is preferable. But in any case, the ripper is there for those people that don't have CloneDVD and who still want to be able to use AnyDVD with their favorite backup program.

Would CloneDVD2 remove protections and region restriction if AnyDVD is not present in the system? I think that CloneDVD2 cannot remove protections/restrictions, but that AnyDVD does do the job.

Assuming that CloneDVD cannot remove protection and region restriction, is it necessary to directly rip a protected DVD using AnyDVD? Or can one simply use CloneDVD2 if AnyDVD is present in the system? Would AnyDVD work in the background when using CloneDVD2 for removing protection and region restriction?

Kalkas

 

[SamuriHL]

Would CloneDVD2 remove protections and region restriction if AnyDVD is not present in the system? I think that CloneDVD2 cannot remove protections/restrictions, but that AnyDVD does do the job.

Assuming that CloneDVD cannot remove protection and region restriction, is it necessary to directly rip a protected DVD using AnyDVD? Or can one simply use CloneDVD2 if AnyDVD is present in the system? Would AnyDVD work in the background when using CloneDVD2 for removing protection and region restriction?

Kalkas

CloneDVD2 will NOT work with a CSS protected disc. For that, you need AnyDVD running in the background. What I was referring to in the text you quoted from me was the fact that if you own CloneDVD2 and AnyDVD, it's always best to rip with CloneDVD2 with AnyDVD running in the background, even if you're going to compress it with something else. The reason is that CloneDVD2 gives you the ability to deselect titlesets you don't want to keep, thus giving you more room for the main movie and causing you to have less compression. AnyDVD Ripper will do the same job ripping as CloneDVD2, but it won't have the option to remove titlesets. IOW, CloneDVD2 and AnyDVD Ripper share the same code to clean up the structural protection found on some DVD's(Sony, Disney, etc), however, CloneDVD2 gives you more options. But CloneDVD2 can't do the structural protection fixes on a CSS protected disc unless AnyDVD is running in the background. As you can see, there are various levels of protection employed on discs these days. I hope this didn't confuse you further. If you need a better explanation let me know and I'll try again.

 

[Peer]

Would CloneDVD2 remove protections and region restriction if AnyDVD is not present in the system? I think that CloneDVD2 cannot remove protections/restrictions, but that AnyDVD does do the job.

Assuming that CloneDVD cannot remove protection and region restriction, is it necessary to directly rip a protected DVD using AnyDVD? Or can one simply use CloneDVD2 if AnyDVD is present in the system? Would AnyDVD work in the background when using CloneDVD2 for removing protection and region restriction?

Simple: if you only want to watch a DVD with a "non-matching" region code, it's enough to have AnyDVD running. No rip, no copy no nothing required - just shove in the disc and start your player. That was what James was trying say.

If you do want to rip/copy/... you can use whatever software you want - the simplest and easiest being "xcopy.exe" and "explorer.exe using drag&drop", both components of you windows OS

AnyDVD removes all protections in real time while data is being read from the disc - without you even really noticing, that is what makes AnyDVD stand out from all other DVD decryption tools.

 

[SamuriHL]

Oh, sure, Peer takes the simple approach. Yes, unless you are dealing with DVD Shrink or Nero Recode, following Peer's advice is fine.

I still say "ripping" with CloneDVD2 provides the best experience regardless of what else you use. (Obviously with AnyDVD running, of course). Being able to select what you want to keep while retaining the menus is a brilliant option IMO. And even if you want to compress the result with DVD Shrink or Recode, if you rip it with CloneDVD2, it will always work no matter what the protection. God bless those Slysoft and Elby guys!

 

[Kalkas]

CloneDVD2 will NOT work with a CSS protected disc. For that, you need AnyDVD running in the background. What I was referring to in the text you quoted from me was the fact that if you own CloneDVD2 and AnyDVD, it's always best to rip with CloneDVD2 with AnyDVD running in the background, even if you're going to compress it with something else.

Thanks for your reply.

I also found Webslinger's reply very helpful from the thread Best way to rip with AnyDVD.

You don't need to rip at all and can just directly import the disc directly into whatever burning application you want, provided Anydvd is running in the background. You don't necessarily need to rip first at all. Not having to rip first is one major advantage of using Anydvd.

So, if I understand correctly, AnyDVD works in background (removing CSS-protection, region restriction) when using CloneDVD2 for importing the disc. Please correct me if I have understood it wrong. I just want a confirmation.

Kalkas