What if slysoft can't keep up?

[joeyooser]

The Directv example is not a valid comparison. Directv wanted to keep people from getting free satelite tv- that is their right.

Right, I'm just saying, I think it's possible the studios could win if they keep fighting, in which case they win and the consumers lose.

Slysoft should consider charging an upgrade for each new encryption they have to break - this will bring in more $$$ and incentivize them to keep working away at it.

 

[chenhua]

What if slysoft can't keep cracking the new encryption systems and they successfully go closed? DirecTV was in a war for a long time and I believe they eventually succeeded in locking up their system so tight no one can steal service any more.

The fact that the cracking of the latest HD-DVD did not happen instantly is a sign that it's becoming more difficult to do. Even if slysoft does crack it again, they may not be able to next time.

It is funny. Same company who make Directv chip make bd+

http://www.dishnewschats.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5275&page=2
http://cptwg.org/Assets/Presentations 2007/2007-06-20_cryptofirewall_cptwg.pdf
http://www.cryptography.com/technology/spdc/bluray.html

 

[iansilv]

It is funny. Same company who make Directv chip make bd+

http://www.dishnewschats.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5275&page=2
http://cptwg.org/Assets/Presentations 2007/2007-06-20_cryptofirewall_cptwg.pdf
http://www.cryptography.com/technology/spdc/bluray.html

So what? Who cares? DirecTV charges to deliver content to your home. That is their business. I am glad that they locked up their systems so douche bags can't get free DirecTV.

Are you saying that you want free DirecTV? THAT is STEALING. They do not own the content, they deliver it to you and charge you to do so. You can actually get better picture with an OTA antenna, and you can get free basic channels. DirecTV has made a business out of putting satellites in orbit and beaming down a high quality television signal to people who are willing to pay for it. When you circumvent that with a hack card, then you are stealing. Unless you continue to pay your bill for fun.

If you use anydvd hd to copy a disk and give it to your friend, THAT is STEALING.

If you use Anydvd to back up media you legitimately own, that is not stealing, that is backing up.

I think this needs to be clarified here. Most of us (I hope) want Slysoft to win so we can make legitimate backups of our legitimately bought media. Comparing DirecTV's encryption methods and motivations degrades the efforts of Slysoft and makes it look like nothing more than a piracy tool.

 

[iansilv]

Right, I'm just saying, I think it's possible the studios could win if they keep fighting, in which case they win and the consumers lose.

Slysoft should consider charging an upgrade for each new encryption they have to break - this will bring in more $$$ and incentivize them to keep working away at it.

They will only win if BD+ remains un-crackable. If it gets broken, we will win because their will be no perfect copy protection schemes, and I can make my legitimate backups.

I honestly think that in all of this format war, nothing will decide things like an unbreakable encryption scheme.

Go Slysoft!

 

[talon95]

I agree. Blu-ray will win if BD+ proves effective. Not because consumers will choose BD, but because the studios will and consumers will have no choice if they want HD movies.

 

[europeman]

Why worry about what you cannot control.

 

[Galileo2000]

8)

They will only win if BD+ remains un-crackable. If it gets broken, we will win because their will be no perfect copy protection schemes, and I can make my legitimate backups.

I honestly think that in all of this format war, nothing will decide things like an unbreakable encryption scheme.

Go Slysoft!

Do you really think "they" will... win if BD+ remains un-crackable?

Guess how many un-crackable unbackable BD+ discs I am going to buy..

 

[Webslinger]

8)

Do you really think "they" will... win if BD+ remains un-crackable?

Guess how many un-crackable unbackable BD+ discs I am going to buy..

I think James feels the same way as you do.

But what choice will you have if all the studios switch to Blu-ray because BD+ can't be decrypted?

I get a sense of deja-vu reading this thread.

 

[Galileo2000]

I think James feels the same way as you do.

But what choice will you have if all the studios switch to Blu-ray because BD+ can't be decrypted?

I get a sense of deja-vu reading this thread.

I have a choice all right.

All my SD DVDs are coming from my 4 XL1B2(should I say "Sony"? ) 200-DVD changers thru my HTPC. If I had never seen HDM I would call PQ excellent.

But guess what, I'll stay with my SD DVDs and will find myself another hobby.

Studios don't want my $$$, fine.

On the subject: Come on, guys, it is not an easy web crap programming every so-called programmer who knows 20 Java commands and 5 Linux commands and 3 SQL statements are doing those days. Have a little patience. I am sure SlySoft is working their butt on this. It is their pride if anything.

 

[Webslinger]

But guess what, I'll stay with my SD DVDs and will find myself another hobby.

How long do you believe it will be before new releases are no longer made available on dvd?

I am not a big Sony fan. I do not relish the thought of Blu-ray being the only game in town.

 

[Ozzlander]

8)

Do you really think "they" will... win if BD+ remains un-crackable?

Guess how many un-crackable unbackable BD+ discs I am going to buy..

That's all well and good - for us here, who are much more technically minded. I'd bet there are still many 'average' consumers out there that don't back up their DVDs.

Those same average consumers, when they move to HiDef won't back those up either. They won't care about the copy protection used, they'll just put the disk in their standalone player & enjoy the high definition picture etc.

Having an uncrackable copy protection method to them will be meaningless - and they will be the vast majority when HiDef overtakes DVD.

Ian

 

[Galileo2000]

That's all well and good - for us here, who are much more technically minded. I'd bet there are still many 'average' consumers out there that don't back up their DVDs.

Those same average consumers, when they move to HiDef won't back those up either. They won't care about the copy protection used, they'll just put the disk in their standalone player & enjoy the high definition picture etc.

Having an uncrackable copy protection method to them will be meaningless - and they will be the vast majority when HiDef overtakes DVD.

Ian

Except there are a lot of problems as of right now with BD+ enabled discs on the standalone players. Some say it is BD-J and not BD+ at fault. No one knows for sure, I guess James and Peer could give us some insight.

And there will be BD Profile 1.1 and 2.0 coming. Which is a promise for even more prolems.

Thing is, if they keep playing those games, "we" tech people will say "Forget it" to our J6P friends and they will follow our advice.

So HDM will go SACD and DVD-A route.

 

[Galileo2000]

How long do you believe it will be before new releases are no longer made available on dvd?

mmm..really long time. Basically all the new HD-DVDs are the dual format: HD-DVDs and SD DVDs.

I am not a big Sony fan. I do not relish the thought of Blu-ray being the only game in town.

Why do you think Sony just sold Cell CPU factories to Toshiba?

Cell CPU is the heart of PS3, mind you.

BD will not be the only game in town, not in foreseeable future..

 

[Webslinger]

Why do you think Sony just sold Cell CPU factories to Toshiba?

Oh, that's interesting. I hadn't read about that.

 

[Galileo2000]

Oh, that's interesting. I hadn't read about that.

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/semiconductors/sony-sells-cell-chip-business-to-toshiba-312279.php

At your service.

 

[Webslinger]

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/semiconductors/sony-sells-cell-chip-business-to-toshiba-312279.php

At your service.

Thank you! :agree:

 

[Peer]

Except there are a lot of problems as of right now with BD+ enabled discs on the standalone players. Some say it is BD-J and not BD+ at fault. No one knows for sure, I guess James and Peer could give is some insight.

And there will be BD Profile 1.1 and 2.0 coming. Which is a promise for even more prolems.

Thing is, if they keep playing those games, "we" tech people will say "Forget it" to our J6P friends and they will follow our advice.

So HDM will go SACD and DVD-A route.

It is hard to tell exactly which "technology" the players are choking on most currently. The problem is the complexity of them.
BD-J is a full sized Java implementation that gives authors the freedom and flexibility to do so many things.
Every developer knows - the more complex your program is, the more bugs will (not might) be in it. This applies to BD discs and players alike.
BD+ also has a lot of potential to screw things up.

The latest player software comes with some very advanced obfuscation techniques. These make it very hard for the developers themselves to keep a clear view on what they are doing.
So basically, I'm quite sure the players were much more stable if they were just players without all that DRM stuff.

Anyway - to address some speculation about what is going to come (or not): MKB4 is a little tough indeed, but we're making good progress.
BD+ may take a while longer, but will be beaten in the end.

If the fact that BD+ holds a little longer should decide the format war it'd be a pity - BD+ surely will take far less than a year in the end and then will be done for good. So in the long run, there's no point for the studios to take BD+ into account when making their choices.

 

[TM2-Megatron]

Good to hear about the progress. Studios likely aren't foolish enough to buy into a format based merely on DRM... they should have people working for them who know that there's almost no encryption that can't be broken somehow. And it doesn't seem likely that unbreakable encryption techniques are feasible for use on a mass-produced product.

Of course, that doesn't stop them from preferring the most DRM schemes possible, which I suppose helps Blu-Ray's image in their eyes.

Personally, I only really prefer Blu-Ray because it seems the better format to use for computers and storage; and HD-DVD is so far behind in this aspect. Strip off all those DRM schemes, and Blu-Ray emerges the technically superior format. I've heard Blu-Ray was conceived of as a writable computer format first, then adopted as an HD home video medium after; while the opposite is true for HD-DVD.

 

[talon95]

Yea, I only think the studios would jump to BD of BD+ persisted for a long period of time (maybe a couple of years). It wouldn't be an overnight defection by any means.

I only mentioned that before because I would absolutely hate to see this happen. I've gone from being a Sony fan to the point of not buying their products at all if I can avoid it.

In regards to DVD's, I think they will be around for a long time. They have huge market penetration. Not only do people have set top players, but they have DVD players in their computers, portable players, and even players in some cars. Although some people haven't liked them, I still think the HD-DVD dual format disks are a positive from this standpoint.

Thanks for the update Peer.

 

[James]

If Slysoft does not keepup, and everyone else at Doom9 cannot break BD+, BluRay will win. That's it- studios will not be able to resist an uncrackable encryption. That is why we should not be buying bluray- to show that consumers want the convenience of watching our media when we want to.

No, wrong assumption. The format which *sells* will win. Money matters. Nothing else.