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Upconvert players

Discussion in 'CloneDVD' started by david686, Jun 5, 2007.

  1. david686

    david686 New Member

    Question: Will cloned DVD's using standard 4.7 blanks be upconverted to HD like resolution when played on an upconvert player when played into a HDtv?
     
  2. Whisperer

    Whisperer Well-Known Member

    david686,
    Welcome to ssf. Yes, your backup has the same characteristics as your original. This upconvert player gets good reviews:

    http://www.oppodigital.com/

    Best regards,
    Whisperer
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2007
  3. Rich86

    Rich86 Well-Known Member

    Upconverted Copy vs. Original

    I would only add that since you are burning your backup copy to a single layer media, transcoding may be required to make it fit. If the compression of the video is greatly increased in this process, you can have adverse effects on the video quality of your copy - which will naturally negatively impact how the video looks on your HDTV after upconverting. So you may want to pay attention to what you care more about - the best possible quality of the main movie, vs. having all extras and menus, etc. on the backup copy, and proceed accordingly.
    I generally only include extras beyond the main movie if the movie fits with no additional compression required. This approach has worked well for me so far, and viewing on my upconverting player/hdtv combination has been very satisfactory.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2007
  4. Whisperer

    Whisperer Well-Known Member

    Right you are Rich! I never compress my backups, so that didn't occur to me. ... so sorry David for my incomplete answer.

    My answer is based on 100% original quality via splitting onto two SL media or backing up to DL media. When one transcodes a backup, one way of describing the compression of a movie to fit onto SL media is that you are throwing away data that results in lower visual quality. If you upconvert to a HD screen (which displays at a higher resolution than even normal DVD 480 lpi interlaced being converted to progressive non-interlaced output) any level of compression will become apparent when compared to playing the original.

    Whisperer
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2007
  5. Flicks

    Flicks New Member

    I would like to offer perhaps a slightly different view on this subject. The Oppo is good unit, no question about it. But the question was asked if a copied movie would be upconverted to HD like resolutions. The answer is really a - somewhat and nothing more than that. HD content is considered at least 1080i / 720p / 1080p. A standard DVD only has a resolution of 480p. Although the upconverting will assist the 480p resolution by reading the pixels and adding information to the desired played resolution, there is still only 480p worth of resolution available.

    That being said, using the right upconverting player (the Oppo is one for sure), the picture will look better than playing through a standard DVD player. A HD-DVD or Blue-Ray disk, will look marketly better on nearly all accounts (again, depending on the original transfer).
     
  6. Whisperer

    Whisperer Well-Known Member

    Flicks,
    Totally true. The upconverted image is just an emulation (using the player's firmware based algorithm) of higher resolution based on the surrounding pixels. It is never as good as an HD original played on the same rig. The 480dpi resolution of a DVD can only be truly and "naturally" improved upon by outputing in non-interlaced progressive mode (480ni lpi aka 480p) ie in progressive mode, all on-screen lines are refreshed on every refresh cycle rather than every other line being refreshed.

    "Upconversion" is similar (in effect) to using Adobe Photoshop to "resample" an image of a certain size (with, for instance a 72dpi resolution) to be larger than it's original size. A complex software algorithm is used to sample surrounding pixels to create more pixels for an "emulation" of the image content that is larger and contains more pixels or even larger and of a higher resolution. This is fine for viewing images from a distance, but on close inspection, it is a poor substitute for scanning an original image at a higher resolution to begin with. You can see the that it is a "phony" solution.

    I just interpreted David's question to be that he was going to do this anyway so he wanted to know if a backup upconverts the same as an original. Answer: No if it is compressed; yes if it is copied with 1:1 quality. If you are just planning whether buy an upconverting player for the purpose of trying (hoping) to increase the inherent resolution of a DVD to HD quality, then I'd suggest that you have a good return policy on the player and make a judgement for yourself as to whether you like visual results of the upconversion emulation.

    Whisperer
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2007
  7. Rich86

    Rich86 Well-Known Member

    I agree with you. However, my dvd's look significantly better on my Sharp 1080p tv via hdmi when played through my Sony upconverting dvd player when compared to playing them via my Pioneer player using component connections on the same tv. I'm sure a full HD player and media would be even much better - but I'm not willing to roll the dice on which format will win that little market contest . . .
     
  8. Whisperer

    Whisperer Well-Known Member

    Rich86,
    I wonder if some upconverting players have better emulation algorithms than others? Some are pleased with the effects, others thrash it. Never seen any user comparisons of one upconverting player vs another. But after viewing true HD, there is no comparison and upconversion is just a finger-in-the-dike until the masses part with their money for the new high definition products.

    While it's true that I am waiting for prices to lower for original disks, players, burners, media and the arrival of backup software to protect my investment. ... there is no question in my mind that I will support HD-DVD. And that is more of a vote against sony Blu standard than a vote for HD! The day I pay sony a dollar for something that is available from another vendor will be the day someone stole and used my credit card! RooTkit was the final straw for me splitting with sony.

    Whisperer
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2007
  9. david686

    david686 New Member

    Thanks for all the infor. I was thinking about up-grading my system to HD, but now I will wait and see.