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True HD output and Power DVD

But multichannel PCM is a lossless format and that can be transmitted over HDMI 1.x. This is where you still seem mistaken. There is nothing in HDMI 1.x to stop ATI sending 6/7/8 channel PCM over HDMI 1.2. Now whether the reason they do not is some limitation of their hardware or a driver restriction due to no secure path and whether that will be fixed for the 2xxx series or 3xxx series we simply do not know right now. But what we do know is provided you are happy for the PC to do the decoding and pass multi-channel, lossless, PCM to your amp this can happen quite happily over HDMI 1.x.

I also disagree with your 2nd point. At the moment there is no PC-based HDMI solution for lossless audio that works, so the point is somewhat moot, but if Cyberlink get it working as they have promised in PowerDVD8 there is no reason why you will not be able to select "bitstream" or "multichannel PCM", just as you can currently select 2/3/4/5/6/7/8 speakers or s/pdif.
 
You are completely correct, Uncompressed PCM is a lossless format, I unfortunately have been in the habit of referring only to the new codecs. As such I considered TrueHD DTS MA etc as formats and bitstream and PCM as a method of transfer, semantics really.

As for the ATI cards, from what I can understand, the sound is transmitted in a similar method to S/pdif, so if that is the case then there would not be enough bandwidth to transmit PCM to the HDMI which is capable. Also since PCM is a digital format it won t likely get implemented until PaP is a reality. If I am wrong on any of this I am sure you ll be quick to point it out.

I m not sure why you disagree with my 2nd point, as you stated it really is moot until a HDMI solution is available. If one existed then you would be correct in disagreeing, otherwise I agree that it might become an option in powerdvd in the future.

Also, could you give me a link to where it says that Cyberlink is working on that? I ve been looking for information on the next release every where. All that I had heard was planned was DTS MA and profile 1.1 support.

Anyways, while your information has been accurate and appreciated, it does not suit this topic. ATM you cannot output Uncompressed PCM from a PC. The OP just wanted to know how to get 5.1 TrueHD from his PC. The best way ATM is via analog until a HDMI solution is available. With that, unless someone else has any relevant input, I don t see the need to continue this discussion
 
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I have not read anywhere the details of the ATI implementation so we are stabbing in the dark a little, but the difference between 1.2 and 1.3 is not bandwidth it is more of a protocol issue. The bandwidth is certainly there for 8 channels of multichannel lossless PCM. My amp specifically came out too soon for TrueHD decoding but it does support 8 channel multi-channel PCM over HDMI.

Regarding Cyberlink's plans here are a couple of articles:

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2007/10/08/powerdvd_ultra_audio_downsampling_explained/1

http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4874&Itemid=3

I am sure there is a better release around CES confirming HDMI support improvements but I cannot find it right now. I will keep looking.
 
Thanks for the links. BTW here is a link to a discussion over at AVS about audio in ati 2xxx series of cards:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12866844

While the difference in 1.2 and 1.3 is indeed amatter of protocols, since the audio is passed to the card in a manner similar to s/pdif, the most it can output is 2 channel PCM.
 
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The point is it may be true of the 2xxx series and that limitation may be hardware or may be a driver issue, but it is definitely not a limitation of HDMI 1.2 and may or may not also affect the 3xxx series or future HDMI card implementations
 
ajeffo said:
I asked a question of Cyberlink support about how the TrueHD is supported over digital and analog and they gave the the following answer.

Sp/dif is downmixed to TrueHD 2.0 at 16 bit / 48kHz

Analog is not downmixed it is still 24bit / 48kHz - this is using the 6 speaker set up in PDVD
Click to expand...

Can PowerDVD downmix a TrueHD soundtrack to 5.1 DD or DTS and output via SPDIF? I see conflicting info on this. I am not interested in TrueHD. But a disc a recently rented (Surf's Up) only had a TrueHD and PCM 5.1 soundtrack which PowerDVD would only output as PCM 2.0.

Also if PowerDVD does downmix to 5.1 DD/DTS, does the OEM version (one included with LG GGC-H20 drive) do this or do I need to buy the retail version?
 
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samw97 said:
Can PowerDVD downmix a TrueHD soundtrack to 5.1 DD or DTS and output via SPDIF? I see conflicting info on this. I am not interested in TrueHD. But a disc a recently rented (Surf's Up) only had a TrueHD and PCM 5.1 soundtrack.

Also if PowerDVD does downmix to 5.1 DD/DTS, does the OEM version (one included with LG GGC-H20 drive) do this or do I need to buy the retail version?
Click to expand...
At the moment PowerDVD converts all TrueHD to 2-channel PCM when using s/pdif. I have logged an incident with Cyberlink about this and they have confirmed it as a 'bug', which is with development to fix. At the moment I am using Realtek's "Dolby Digital Live" to encode 6-channel PCM back to 640kb/s DD for my amp. Depending on your hardware you may be able to do the same, or even better convert to DTS as the latest chipsets allow.

Regarding the OEM version I have recently bought the LG GGW-H20L and it is a "kludged" 2-channel version. :( You have to upgrade to the retail version to get 5.1 support, but there is an upgrade price of $79.95. Not much of a reduction, but something at least.
 
Jong said:
At the moment PowerDVD converts all TrueHD to 2-channel PCM when using s/pdif. I have logged an incident with Cyberlink about this and they have confirmed it as a 'bug', which is with development to fix. At the moment I am using Realtek's "Dolby Digital Live" to encode 6-channel PCM back to 640kb/s DD for my amp. Depending on your hardware you may be able to do the same, or even better convert to DTS as the latest chipsets allow.

Regarding the OEM version I have recently bought the LG GGW-H20L and it is a "kludged" 2-channel version. :( You have to upgrade to the retail version to get 5.1 support, but there is an upgrade price of $79.95. Not much of a reduction, but something at least.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the response.

When you say "5.1 support", what exactly do you mean? The OEM version outputs 5.1 DD/DTS/DD+ through SPDIF.
 
The totally honest answer is I cannot remember 100%. You certainly cannot select more than 2-speakers in non-s/pdif mode and you will not get 5.1 channels for TrueHD. But it is possible that s/pdif passthrough of a non-HD 5.1 soundtrack worked. Still pretty hopeless if you are buying for HD. Some discs do not have a DD soundtrack, only TrueHD, leaving it to the player to decode and then re-encode if using s/pdif. I would say you will end up needing the upgrade. I certainly did.
 
Jong said:
Regarding the OEM version I have recently bought the LG GGW-H20L and it is a "kludged" 2-channel version. :( You have to upgrade to the retail version to get 5.1 support, but there is an upgrade price of $79.95. Not much of a reduction, but something at least.
Click to expand...
I have the OEM version, and did the purchase, but never found an upgrade price! Ended up paying $95US, since they had a $5 off sale at the time.....

Guess I could have saved $20!
 
I managed to get the 5.1 through spdif even though the movie just has true hd:
I selected "6 speakers" in the Power DVD audio menu instead of spdif. Then I selected spdif in my soundcard driver and it worked for me it didn't downmix to true hd 2.0 like it did before. My soundcard is connected via a toslink optical cable with my AV receiver.
Quite simple solution for me here though....
 
Xtrap1979 said:
I managed to get the 5.1 through spdif even though the movie just has true hd:
I selected "6 speakers" in the Power DVD audio menu instead of spdif. Then I selected spdif in my soundcard driver and it worked for me it didn't downmix to true hd 2.0 like it did before. My soundcard is connected via a toslink optical cable with my AV receiver.
Quite simple solution for me here though....
Click to expand...

Xtrap, you are using the OEM version of PDVD packaged with the LG GGC-H20L drive?
 
Xtrap1979 said:
I managed to get the 5.1 through spdif even though the movie just has true hd:
I selected "6 speakers" in the Power DVD audio menu instead of spdif. Then I selected spdif in my soundcard driver and it worked for me it didn't downmix to true hd 2.0 like it did before. My soundcard is connected via a toslink optical cable with my AV receiver.
Quite simple solution for me here though....
Click to expand...
I believe that does what I am doing at the moment - PowerDVD outputs 6-channel PCM and your sound card encodes to Dolby Digital @640kb/s. For Reatek chips it is called "Dolby Digital Live".

It wroks pretty well, but it does mean everything is converted to DD unless it is s/pdif, so typically even high quality PCM audio (eg. CD) will be encoded to Dolby Digital.
 
Jong said:
I believe that does what I am doing at the moment - PowerDVD outputs 6-channel PCM and your sound card encodes to Dolby Digital @640kb/s. For Reatek chips it is called "Dolby Digital Live".

It wroks pretty well, but it does mean everything is converted to DD unless it is s/pdif, so typically even high quality PCM audio (eg. CD) will be encoded to Dolby Digital.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that#s what I'm doing right now I'm using a Realtek chipset as well.
The solution is okay for me since I'm not that much of an audio junky. I'm pleased when I have sourround sound from 6 speakers and of course the solution is much better than the true hd 2.0 downmix instead......
 
Jong said:
I believe that does what I am doing at the moment - PowerDVD outputs 6-channel PCM and your sound card encodes to Dolby Digital @640kb/s. For Reatek chips it is called "Dolby Digital Live".

It wroks pretty well, but it does mean everything is converted to DD unless it is s/pdif, so typically even high quality PCM audio (eg. CD) will be encoded to Dolby Digital.
Click to expand...
C-Media has chipsets with DTS Interactive, offering the same ease of installation as DD Live, but with 1.5MBit/s bitrate.
I use as Auzentech X-Plosion card with the C-Media DTS Interactive.
 
Yeh, that sounds a lot better. Thanks for the input.

I will stick with DD @640kb/s for now and see how the whole PowerDVD8/HDMI audio thing works out. If it does not, then your card sounds a good second best.

Personally I'd prefer it to using any internal PC card to do DAC and passing analogue to my amp.
 
Sad to find out my MB has the Realtek AC850 audio codec which does not support DD Live or DTS Connect.

Looks like the only way for me to enjoy 5.1 audio from discs played with PowerDVD with only TrueHD/5.1 PCM soundtracks is to use the analog outputs (i.e. buy a new receiver) or getting a new soundcard.

Anyone have a better alternative?
 
I have tested both the Dolby Digital @ 640 Kb/sec(Dolby Digital Live) and the DTS @ 1.5 mb/sec(DTS Connect). Both sounds very good but neither of them are much better than the other. Personally I am totally satisfied with Dolby Digital Live right now. I will wait to upgrade my receiver if the Auzentech card ends up doing what they advertise.
 
samw97 said:
Sad to find out my MB has the Realtek AC850 audio codec which does not support DD Live or DTS Connect.

Looks like the only way for me to enjoy 5.1 audio from discs played with PowerDVD with only TrueHD/5.1 PCM soundtracks is to use the analog outputs (i.e. buy a new receiver) or getting a new soundcard.

Anyone have a better alternative?
Click to expand...
As I said, Cyberlink have acknowledged this as a bug. Hopefully it will be fixed in the next release.
 
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