List of BD+ Discs/Revocation Issues

Discussion in 'AnyDVD HD (Blu-ray issues)' started by mick2006, Oct 6, 2007.

  1. mick2006

    mick2006 Well-Known Member

    I think we should keep a running list of BD+ discs so that people don't buy these titles if they don't want to. Also, does anyone know "for certain" if a BD+ title is placed in our BD drive it will inhibit the ripping of all future BD discs that we place in the drive? If this is true we should definately keep an updated list of BD+ titles.
     
  2. DonCarlos

    DonCarlos Well-Known Member

    No that has nothing to do with BD+, it has something to do with the revocation list in AACS. Every time they release a new MKB version in the MKB is a revocation list. The discs checks the list which is stored in the drives and if they are an older version they update it. So all the hosts are revoked the drive does not give anything of the movie away also an older dsc can't be playedany more. Than you need to update the host that you can play again a movie. That is what is happening but I do not know if this is only implemented in the santandalone players or if it is also implemented in the drives availible for a PC as well.But it has nothing to do with Bluray or BD+ it can also happen to you with a HDDVD....
     
  3. colinhunt

    colinhunt Well-Known Member

    It would be interesting to hear whether Slysoft has been able to verify whether FF2 and TDAT Blu-rays actually have BD+ or not. Peer & co., how about it?
     
  4. DonCarlos

    DonCarlos Well-Known Member

  5. blobb

    blobb Guest

    How is that even supposed to work? BD+ would have to install some kind of software either in the drive or on your PC. Installing software without the permission of the owner is illegal in some countries, i doubt they would risk the possible lawsuits.
     
  6. Peer

    Peer Redfox Development Team Staff Member

    yes, they have

    No - where's the need to "install" anything? The Player is already installed on your system; with your permission, doubtless :)

    PowerDVD simply "executes" some vm code from the disc - which I find no less frightening, given that under some circumstances even "native code" can be executed, which I find to be a very serious security issue.
    Remember Sony who didn't even hesitate to install rootkits on PCs from movie-DVDs when you only wanted to watch a movie (uhhm, who was it again behind the curtains of blu-ray? ;) )...

    Again and again.... : hands off blu-ray, stick to HD-DVD!
     
  7. mick2006

    mick2006 Well-Known Member

    Peer,
    Are you saying that if we try to decrypt one of these newer blu ray discs something will attach itself in our blu ray drive and we "won't" be able to rip future blu ray discs? Or, is it Powerdvd that is the culprit here? Also, would it be possible to shut down AnyDvd HD before inserting the blu ray disc and look at the disc structure to tell whether or not BD+ is on it? And should be stay away from all blu rays or just the newer ones from Fox?
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2007
  8. mick2006

    mick2006 Well-Known Member

    Dracula Blu Ray IS OK

    I attempted to rip Bram Stoker's Dracula and found that it was just a bad disc (got to 3% and it stopped-play also stoppe in my PS3), my exchanged copy ripped fine.
     
  9. blobb

    blobb Guest

    That still doesnt make sense, something still needs to stop me from ripping ALL Blu-Ray discs in the scenario mick2006 mentioned. I doubt very much PowerDVD is programmed to work as a rootkit in the background, stopping any kind of ripping attempts.

    And do you remember the terrible press Sony got for their rootkits and the lawsuits and how much it cost them? Also wasnt it music CDs in that case? I can't imagine Sony risking a similar rootkit disaster again. The bad press would kill Blu-Ray a lot faster than anything lese Sony could screw up.

    And i don't have to have any Player software installed, i could rip on one PC and watch the ripped discs on a different one.
     
  10. colinhunt

    colinhunt Well-Known Member

    I see absolutely no proof of BD+ in that article. There's no direct quote from Fox, for example. What if another blog makes a post saying there's no BD+ on those discs? It's just another post on the internet.

    However, since Peer says there is BD+ on those discs, I'm sure that's the case.

    Peer, would you mind revealing how you/Slysoft verified the existence of BD+ on those two titles?
     
  11. jdohn2002

    jdohn2002 Well-Known Member

    I finally got the link from cyberlink for the new patch, but I am still having issues playing from discs. I can play ripped BLU-RAY and HD-DVD files no problem. Everytime I try to play from a BLU-RAY disc using Power DVD Ultra it gives me the same message:

    "A critical component of the player requires periodic update. New movies
    could fail to play if the component is not updated promptly. Would you like to
    update now?"

    After I click "YES" it says:
    Player application update
    update finished

    Then I try it again after the update and it does the same thing over again.
     
  12. DonCarlos

    DonCarlos Well-Known Member

    No there isn't an offical quot from Fox ok you are right. But what do you think is happening you can read that article. You know Fox stoped releasing new Blu ray until BD+ is ready. Suddenly all the standalone players need so much time to load the movie. And on AVSforum are many articles which say BD+ is here. I don't now how Slysoft discoverd it but on doom9 the people discoverd a folder called BDSVM. This folder only appears on the new BD+ releases from fox. It could stand for secure virtual maschine.(I can only say what I know and want to help you).

    I think the scenario mick2006 said is very unrealistic.(but when you say Sony you never know...)But PowerDVD has nothing to do with rootkits or something like that because if it had the HDDVD could als do it. No the only thing which exsists is the AACS revocation list which is updated with every new MKB and BD+ which checks that you do not do things with the movies they do not like you to do for example decrypt them. Of course there are other ways to protect the content for example watermarking...and the AACS LA wants to implement themand such crap. But that is a little bit to far in the future I think. I think they can do what they want until they still want you to watch the movie they have to give you the option to decrypt it and here Slysoft comes in the game...you just should wait now until BD+ is cracked and then you see on.
    Or to say it with James' words use HDDVD :D
     
  13. mick2006

    mick2006 Well-Known Member

    All I am asking is "Can we turn off AnyDVd and take a look at the disc structure to see if that BDSVM folder is there?" Will turning off AnyDvd allow the disc to assume there is no "decryption" program running on the machine, thus revoking keys?
     
  14. Adbear

    Adbear Well-Known Member

    What film? I havn't got any of the new Fox movies yet (we have a postal strike in the UK, so they're stuck somewhere) but after the update my version of Troy worked fine. What version number was in the file name?
     
  15. jdohn2002

    jdohn2002 Well-Known Member

    I've tried: The Punisher, Pirates 2, and Final Fantasy:Spirits Within. No luck with any of them. I had no problem backing up "The Punisher" and playing from the HHD. I just can't seem to play the original discs. I emailed Cyberlink about it, but have not heard back yet. Has anybody else installed the new patch for Power DVD (3319) after trying to play "Day After Tomorrow" or Rise Of The Silver Surfer" ?
     
  16. Peer

    Peer Redfox Development Team Staff Member

    Does PCFriendly on DVDs ring a bell? :)

    Of course, pdvd is not programmed to work as a rootkit. It seems some haven't yet quite understood the concept of BD+.

    BD+ is a bunch of commands (like java they are independant of processor architecture) that are processed by the player.
    I don't know all BD+ commands, but I'm sure, they are nearly all harmless code that is designed to merely check the system/disc for anomalies (passively) - and of course do some additional decryption.

    There is one provision supposedly included with BD+, that does sound alarming to me: it can load native code (like x86 machine code) into memory under certain circumstances and run it.
    In other words: the disc tells pdvd to load a chunk of executable code into memory and execute it. PowerDVD will not even know, what this code does - but neither will you!
    It doesn't take a rootkit to make this a hijacking scenario.

    Oh and by the way - the same crap can happen with your standalone player, it just takes native code for that player.

    So, what do we have... Sony makes movies, sells players, plays the major role behind Blu-Ray and we'll add this BD+ stuff just as icing.
    I think at this point anyone should see, that it might be a big mistake to hand over the whole movie business from the making down to the player at home in one scoop to Sony - especially knowing the face of Sony from the past.
    In the end, they'll have you, the customer, in their claws and can do with you what they want, dictate what you see and even how you do it.
    James would have have some technical reasons to add as well, I'll just leave it right here,
    Now's the time for voting - when the format war is decided, the voting booths close...

    Think about it.
     
  17. colinhunt

    colinhunt Well-Known Member

    It probably does, and that's good enough proof for me that those titles contain BD+. But judging from what I've read, stand-alone player problems are not caused by BD+ but by BD-Java used on the discs.
     
  18. DonCarlos

    DonCarlos Well-Known Member

    Good to have you and Slysoft to kill this supid BD+ stuff.:D:bowdown::D:agree:

    As far as I know when ANYDVD decrpyts on the fly PowerDVD just see HD files with nothing more. Than I have two questions. Will you be able to also decrpypt BD+ on the fly? And when I am thinking the right way after ANYDVD decrypted the files PowerDVD could nothing load an execute, because nothing from that crap "reaches" PowerDVD?!
     
  19. DonCarlos

    DonCarlos Well-Known Member

    Yes you are right with the BD-Java. Sorry for the wrong inforamtion I just read up myself......
     
  20. mick2006

    mick2006 Well-Known Member

    I tried turning off AnyDvd Hd and taking a look at the file structure of some of my older BD's and my system doesn't even recognize that there is a disc in the tray. When I click on "my computer" the drive shows up as DVD-RAM drive and when I click on "Explore" it says "inset a disc". I don't know what this means, does anyone. When I turned AnyDVD back on, then the disc showed up and I could explore the disc's folders. Theoretically, I don't think I should need anydvd on my system to play a blu ray disc.