Lifetime licenses? Why keep them?

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Sabertooth, Mar 6, 2016.

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  1. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Well-Known Member

    It's because of the timing that I wanted a discussion of the matter to provide insight in to the issue from the active members for the ones making the decisions. The open discussion of ideas also prepares us for the unknown future. Your opinions even critical ones and your reassurances are appreciated.

    If you did not mention it, I would not have known. If I am unclear about what you say I will ask you to clarify but that happens with native English speakers too so do not take it as a reflection on your communications skills. If you prefer I will try to limit contractions, i.e.; I'll instead of I will. Whatever you are most comfortable with.

    Are you saying to completely eliminate the OPD (Online Protection Database)? You purchase periodic updates to the local cache which contains all definitions for all media?
  2. Glarioo

    Glarioo Well-Known Member

    1. Slysoft is gone. So License (1, 2, ... Lifetime) is gone. It's simple.
    2. If I have to buy a new license, so be it! I don't care - my license expires in sept 2017. All i want is that the RedFox is Alive & stays Alive! It cannot surive with money from the past because that money is gone too.
    3. If i got the possibility to donate, i will gladly do that to.
    4. I'm not rich, i am just a working class guy (not a hero, that was John).
  3. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Well-Known Member

    I think you'll find that you bought a license from Slysoft and that license is now void excepting for the mercy of the new owners allowing for some cross over at their complete discretion. I hope to hear all viewpoints but, unless the new owners retained control of the bank accounts and money, don't you think you'll be putting them in a pinch right off the bat. Asking them to assume all the risks without compensation? I suppose a charity donation thing might work but what if it's not enough. Are you saying you wouldn't buy a new license now but might if they announce they're going to close the doors here too at a later date?

    If these folks had retained control of the money then maybe I could see it as just a figurehead but I'm having a hard time seeing how that works out for them since it seems they didn't.
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
  4. TM2-Megatron

    TM2-Megatron Well-Known Member

    I think the biggest misunderstanding regarding the mention of "subscription" licenses is that some people seem to believe their software will no longer work after the subscription expires. Calling them "perptual licenses" might be better, going forward. They work forever, but are only good for the present version. The only thing that would possibly stop functioning is remote access to the OPD, since that's really the part of the program that receives the most constant work.

    I think the key to making that work is to release monthly builds of the OPD for use offline, as James suggested might be possible in this post. That way, someone with an expired license could still have full access to the latest version of the OPD they're eligible for (rounded up to the nearest month). That way, AnyDVD would retain its usefulness both for your current collection, and anything you might purchase in the future that had been released in years past.

    I've posted on this extensively in the other thread on future licenses, however I'll repost some of that here.

    I've been a lifetime license owner since 2006, and received a tremendous return on that in the years since. I also prefer the perpetual license scheme, but even with 99% of perpetual licenses, most software still requires paid updates for major version changes (and those that don't usually cease development sooner or later, as the model becomes increasingly unsustainable). I always wondered in the back of my mind if the lifetime licenses would end up doing SlySoft in before Hollywood.

    I purchase a lot of software, but no other software I own has given me the level of value, constant updates and support that AnyDVD has (and AnyDVD is among the cheapest software I've bought). In 2006, I bought all four products SlySoft offered at the time (AnyDVD, CloneDVD, CloneCD and CloneDVD mobile) in a bundle for a mere $75. A year later, in 2007, I paid just $30 to upgrade to AnyDVD HD. In return, they've provided me with nearly a decade of support and updates... for $105! That's not only unheard of, but when you think about it it's really kind of ludicrous. How is any business expected to function in the long run that way?

    Nearly all that other software requires the occasional upgrade (paid, but usually at a significant discount from the full price) if I want to use the latest version. Even Winzip charges upgrade fees for major version changes, and AnyDVD is immeasurably more valuable and better-maintained than software like that. So if it were up to me, I'd make AnyDVD work more like this:

    €100 - Initial license
    €50 - upgrade fee upon major version changes (eg, 7.x --> 8.x --> 9.x), with upgrades being released every 12-15 months... basically Adobe's model before they turned evil and went Creative Cloud

    Not to seem insensitive to people's financial issues (we've all had money problems), but if we can afford to pay for Blu-rays throughout the year at anywhere from $15-30 for a single movie or $30-$60 for a year's worth of TV episodes, then how is a small fee for continued AnyDVD support too much to ask?
  5. RedFox 1

    RedFox 1 Super Moderator

    All this is just friendly speculation, you dont really know what happened do you? A Rep tried to explain it, but I guess you dont believe what you read. Do you actually have facts to back up those claims or are you just making conversation ?
  6. rdodolak

    rdodolak Well-Known Member

    Do we know that they actually lost access to all existing funds? I would agree that any provider would need funds to remain solvent and I'm sure some customers would consider buying a new license. However, the "new owners" appear to be the same ones that developed the software under the old name. The only difference is the Slysoft name and the Antiguan figurehead are gone but the underlying structure is still intact. And because of this, I'm sure some customers will equate Slysoft to RedFox regardless of the name change.

    But does that mean that a LTL should be a way of the past?
  7. rdodolak

    rdodolak Well-Known Member

    They do and they offer an annual maintenance plan which I believe is $5 per year.
  8. alterverwalter

    alterverwalter Well-Known Member

    I´m of similar opinion as jim2264258 personal I don´t like the idea to disestablish the lifetime license model.

    Further I believe it should be a sufficient business model, as also other comanies (there is one cinese also dealing with copy sowtware - unfortunately actually I can not remember theyr name ;-) can survive offering those form licenses, even if I´m not an economist.

    Nevertheless I see the necissity of any form of repayment for existing Slysoft customers to ensure the software will survive - @ least for a while. For sure the clever guys from the fox team will know what they need to survive and they also will find a payment procedure from that will benefit both programmers and customers.

    We all should wait and see what will happen in near future, the most important thing is that the project is going on.
  9. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Well-Known Member

    If that was the case, then why can't you buy a new license right now this minute. It's clearly not the case but the great job they've done so far in making the transition may lead you to believe that's the case so I don't blame you for seeing it that way.

    I have a limited knowledge of the events surrounding Slysof'ts demise. I'm happy to admit my mistakes but, please, don't assume that I read what you are referring too. Please direct me to the post in question so that I can read it in the event it was something I missed or skimmed over.
  10. TM2-Megatron

    TM2-Megatron Well-Known Member

    Yes, but I believe eligibility for the annual maintenance is only on brand-new license purchasers. This is basically to ensure that if someone purchases the software and Winzip releases a new major version 2 months down the road, the customer doesn't feel too ripped off. You get that one upgrade free of charge, but upon the next major release (a year or whenever down the line), you have to pay the usual upgrade fee.

    From the fine print on Winzip's site, only multi-user licenses are eligible to continue the annual maintenance beyond the first year.

    That would be a good thing for RedFox to implement, as well (the single-user version, not the multi).
  11. Dr. Feelgood

    Dr. Feelgood Member

    Oh no, thank you, but you don't have to. My understanding of written English is about 99.9 percent. Rather I've got problems in building well sounding English phrases "from scratch" ;-)

    That would be one possible option. Another could be you buy only the specific file you need for a specific disc.
  12. rdodolak

    rdodolak Well-Known Member

    You can only sign up for the annual maintenance plan at the time of purchase but you can renew it each year. WinZip sends out an annual email notice for the optional renewal. I've had the plan for years, and I only have a single license, and I have gotten every major new version that has been released.
  13. RedFox 1

    RedFox 1 Super Moderator

    To be honest, not everyone is going to agree, just let it be known that RedFox appreciates its customers more than other software company's, and whatever they decide to do I am sure will be acceptable if they decide to do anything at all, I have no idea. All I know is that speculating on things that did not happen yet is foolish, it may be fun, but foolish. There are many way to speculate how things will change or not change at all, like I said, some of the ideas here are very kind and some are understandable. Everyone here is entitled to their opinion as long as the thread stays friendly I have no objection to this speculation, nor am I going to re-read every post since RedFox was born just to prove a point. Like I have previously said, this a company that actually takes the customers needs in mind and always does whats fair. Have a good time at the RedFox Forum.
  14. TM2-Megatron

    TM2-Megatron Well-Known Member

    That's news to me, and not a bad deal. I just usually wait for their 85% off upgrades e-mail to get the latest version of Winzip Pro and Courier together for around $14.

    Regardless, even they charge either annually ($5-10, depending on whether you have Standard or Pro) or an upgrade fee (thankfully not incremental, as I sometimes skip a version here or there). And Winzip receives only minor updates here and there, and major version increments once every year or year-and-a-half. Up to now, Slysoft gave the option of unlimited updates for life, sometimes with updates coming every week or two. Personally, I don't think that's sustainable considering the work James and other developers put in.
  15. diverjones

    diverjones Well-Known Member

    On the surface this it sounds nice, but however decentralized the structure of Slysoft was, I think we can read between the lines that the developers of Slysoft were "employees" and the owner/figurehead of the company had other business ventures and money coming in from several of them all at the same time. Slysoft may have been a write off, or a wash business wise (we will never know) but with diffenent cash streams I am sure the Slysoft owner just paid his employees like we all get paid. Now since RedFox is its OWN entity with no income save from these few products, I feel it's entirely different.
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
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  16. TM2-Megatron

    TM2-Megatron Well-Known Member

    At one point, at least (not sure about today), the CEO of Slysoft also owned an offshore online gambling outfit. So he did have money coming in from other sources, probably quite a bit of it. Now that it's just RedFox alone, the situation probably is very different.
  17. rdodolak

    rdodolak Well-Known Member

    Even if the figurehead had other sources of income, if Slysoft really was a drain on funds why continue operations and not shut it down or sell it off. Unless of course, there was something of worth in it for the figurehead. But this is all just speculation and only those on the inside know the true nature of the business.
  18. RedFox 1

    RedFox 1 Super Moderator

    This is very true.
  19. zapdoing

    zapdoing Member

    The former SlySoft now RedFox staff have always been very courteous to the whole community and have always shown a lot of understanding and patience.
    They certainly have plenty of work to do at the moment e.g. restructuring the company and of course setting up a licensing model securing the future of the project.
    So let's give them all the time they need and be patient. I'm sure they will come up with a solution satisfying all of us (y)
  20. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Well-Known Member

    All we do know for sure is that Slysoft shutdown and, for a moment, it seemed that AnyDVD was relinquished to the ash heap. Whatever the future model of licensing, I'm sure it will be fair and sustainable and I think we can all agree that we're happy to see it continue. Thank you for the diverse group of opinions expressed so far. All models are valid and only the Redfox management team knows what will work or not. I am not surprised to see some support for alternate pricing models but I admit the Lifetime License support group is large.

    It's all a cost benefit analysis both for us as consumers but, also, for the Redfox team that will now assume the risks of dealing with the motion picture and television industries.

    Please state your opinions, all are welcome but may be challenged in civil discourse.
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