CloneBD & TrueHD

Discussion in 'CloneBD' started by HT_Enthusiast, Oct 22, 2017.

  1. HT_Enthusiast

    HT_Enthusiast Member

    Want to start off the post with a big thank you to the Well-Known members that have helped answer questions through other's posts over the years, since back in the ClownBD days when you had to run EAC3To/ClownBD/IMGBurn independently.

    I have until recently been using Handbrake to convert my personal media to MKV but have recently noticed the severe loss in visual quality when watching on a large screen (120). I have recently purchased Clone BD as i was impressed with the visual quality in the trial.

    When using CloneBD - I keep the original lossless audio as my receiver and player (Shield TV) support lossless playback. DTS-HD files processed through CloneBD playback flawlessly. However when i attempt to playback files containing TrueHD processed through CloneBD (only the lossless track)- my receiver does not detect the the lossless input and Plex gets confused and tries to transcode when it should be direct-play (Plex even recognizes the mkv contains TrueHD in the details).

    When using Handbrake i have been able to pass-through the audio, and not have any issues with playback of TrueHD. (the same 2 files i'm having an issue with when processed with CloneBD play correctly when processed through handbrake)

    Is there a known issue with the way Clone BD processes TrueHD audio? Any suggestions?
  2. Pete

    Pete Forum Admin Staff Member

    I just played around with it a little - I don't have a Shield, so I can't verify that.
    Playback with PowerDVD with passthrough to my receiver worked fine.
    I tried an MKV made with CloneBD, lossless video and lossless audio (Dolby True HD Atmos, receiver showed "Atmos" in the display).

    I'll see if I can install plex for further testing. But so far no problems have been reported with TrueHD.
  3. SamuriHL

    SamuriHL Retired Moderator

    I don't believe there are any Plex clients other than the shield that can bitstream the audio. I have Plex on every device I own (roku, xbox, ps4, etc) and none of them will do it. I don't have a shield, either, but, I can say that all the MKV's I've created bitstream fine using J River MC.
  4. HT_Enthusiast

    HT_Enthusiast Member

    I've tried this with multiple files and it still appears to only occur with the TrueHD audio tracks. I'm not sure how handbrake is passing the audio file through differently than CloneBD.

    Since i was determined to get one working TrueHD file, i processed the same file with CloneBD & Handbrake. Had the same audio trouble with just the CloneBD file.

    So i used MKVToolNix to strip the CloneBD audio file and replace it with the Handbrake audio file as seen below:


    It appears odd that the CloneBD file appears to show 8 channels (in MKVToolNix) when CloneBD itself recognized it as a 5.1 file:


    After replacing the CloneBD audio file with the Handbrake audio file - It is now playing flawlessly, only downside is the extra time/processing involved and it seemed to add .8 GB to the final file (unsure if audio file difference or MKVToolNix overhead).

    Attaching log file in the event that yields any additional information.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Oct 26, 2017
  5. Fabian

    Fabian Developer

    We are investigating why a 7.1 marker is written to the .mkv file.
  6. dewd_1969

    dewd_1969 Member

    Interesting. I just assumed it was broken with a Plex or Shield upgrade. One work around I found was to use Plex for KODI on the Shield. It passes the TrueHD on to my receiver without any issue.
  7. Steve55

    Steve55 Well-Known Member

    There tend to be issues with MKV and TrueHD I have experienced, I believe because MKV container can't handle an AC3 core correctly unless it's remuxed. DTS-HD works fine but TrueHD not.

    The .8 GB difference is definitely not just some kind of overhead added by mkvtoolnix. (Maybe it's coincidence that 5.1 plus 2.0 = 7.1)
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2017
  8. HT_Enthusiast

    HT_Enthusiast Member

    Any update on the investigation? I'll volunteer to test any potential fixes.
  9. HT_Enthusiast

    HT_Enthusiast Member

    What i don't understand is when i use the "passthrough" option with Handbrake they play flawlessly (don't know the technical breakdown of their passthrough vs CloneBD's copy original (lossless) setting) - Will continue to use that workaround until this appears to be fixed in CloneBD for TrueHD
  10. Steve55

    Steve55 Well-Known Member

    It would be good if someone who understands better than me would answer. But I don't think Handbrake is just doing a passthrough, I think it is extracting just the 5.1 track to make a finished 5.1 track. The merging in TrueHD doesn't work like DTS-HD, where one track can play either the core or the complete audio. If you want the AC3 core from TrueHD in a mkv file, it must be saved as a separate track, it can't be combined with the 5.1.
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2017
  11. SamuriHL

    SamuriHL Retired Moderator

    I'm fairly sure that it's because TrueHD on blu-rays does not have an AC3 "core" like DTS-HD has a DTS core. They actually have a separate AC3 track. If you're getting 5.1 from a 7.1 TrueHD track, then it's being converted. I've not had too many issues with TrueHD in MKV containers but I don't add an AC3 track, either, as my equipment is all bitstreaming capable. I always do lossless copy into the MKV container, though.
  12. Pete

    Pete Forum Admin Staff Member

    The upcoming version (no, I don't have a release date) fixes the improper labelling of the track in the container (6 vs. 8 channels).
    Whether that fixes your problem or not remains to be seen, then.
    The information is redundant, as the proper values are in the actual audio stream, so....maybe, maybe no.
    dewd_1969 likes this.
  13. Steve55

    Steve55 Well-Known Member

    Samurai, yes exactly how I understand it and what I was trying to say! DTS has that clever difference thing so that one audio can represent both versions, which TrueHD diesnt have. Thanks!
  14. HT_Enthusiast

    HT_Enthusiast Member

    Thanks for the update Pete - Have a happy Thanksgiving!

    I'm wondering if the issue i'm experiencing is related to 7.1 TrueHD files processed through CloneBD can't be passed through to my Onkyo 5.1 receiver (which decodes TrueHD/DTS-HD. Will be interesting to give that a test when it passes through 6 channels to confirm.

    Still interesting that DTS-HD 7.1 will play fine on that receiver and handbrake processed TrueHD files. From the posts above, i'm convinced handbrake must be doing something to the TrueHD audio file instead of leaving it alone like CloneBD does. Thanks for all your help!