3D Movie ISO'S

Discussion in 'AnyDVD HD (Blu-ray issues)' started by routledgepaul, Jan 10, 2013.

  1. FurryGuy

    FurryGuy Well-Known Member

    It never hurts to ask questions, or show interest in the differences of how 3D can be displayed in 2D. 8)

    I'm interested in the differences in a "gee, that's neat" way but when highly rarefied and refined tech talk starts getting muttered, unasked and obscuring a simple answer to a non-technical question, then enough is enough. If/when I want a more in-depth look at the technical details then I'll start researching it.

    I'm with you about retaining the best audio/video quality. Happy backups! :)
     
  2. routledgepaul

    routledgepaul Well-Known Member

    Sorry FurryGuy misunderstood your first reply :eek:

    Glad we all agree in the end :D
     
  3. RBBrittain

    RBBrittain Well-Known Member

    That's why I said...

     
  4. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    Guys,

    First, sorry to "resurrect" such an old thread, but the topic is applicable and I think my questions probably have short responses (so not worth a new thread)....


    There's a Blu-Ray I want to watch but seems to only be available in 3D -- and I have a 2D TV.

    From reading this thread, I see that I should be able to play the 3D disc in 2D if I check "Simulate ... 3D display" in AnyDVD's Blu-Ray settings.

    Awesome!


    I'm wondering though, will the result look wonky because it's supposed to be 3D or will I be hard-pressed to tell it's a 2D simulation. Will it show in full 1080p glory or something less?


    Also, if I create a protected backup copy, is Simulate..3D a setting that can be turned on and off after the .iso is made?



    Thanks in advance.


    T
     
  5. James

    James Redfox Development Team Staff Member

    Should work, yes. If it doesn't, enable speedmenus. These will work, even if the player isn't 3D capable.

    Not wonky. All will be fine.

    Sure. But why make an image at all? AnyDVD decrypts and remasters in realtime, so just try it on your PC.
     
  6. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    I neglected to mention that the goal is to play the Blu-Ray on the computer using PDVD 17.

    Afaik PDVD is 3D-capable, so I guess that means I would not need to resort to SpeedMenu.

    Not that there's anything wrong with SpeedMenu. I'll use it if I have to but prefer the original Menus if possible.


    Cool. Amazing that you can do this. Now, can't wait to try it...


    When I get it, I'll test the disc on the PC first.

    But if it works, I'll create an .iso. I usually watch movies through my computer using .iso's.

    Have an app I wrote that remembers where it is, fetches the .iso and mounts it for me on any PC in the home network.


    But, just thought -- if I wanted to play the title on my standalone (2D) UHD player, could I copy the .iso to disc by mounting it with AnyDVD's Simulate 3D Display enabled and (Img)burn a 2D-compatible disc?

    Well, maybe this is where SpeedMenu becomes necessary....



    T
     
  7. James

    James Redfox Development Team Staff Member

    A 2D only player won't play it this way.
    Indeed.

    EDIT:
    Hint: You can keep original menus with speedmenus.
     
  8. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member


    No, I know you can have both Original and SpeedMenu but if the disc will not play Original on the UHD player, not much point to it.


    But......


    Good news. I just found out that my UHD player actually is 3D compatible. It's just the TV that is not.


    So now, I should be able to play a disc burned from the .iso (with Simulate 3D Display set) on my 2D TV with the UHD player?



    T
     
  9. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    So, I just discovered that this UHD player already has settings to play 3D on a 2D TV on its own.

    Means I can just play the original 3D Blu-Ray on it and watch it in 2D. (y)


    Still, I would want to add the .iso to my inventory to be played on computer, which is how I normally watch movies.

    And with the help of AnyDVD I see I can do it! :)


    So, putting in an order for the Blu-Ray today.


    Thanks for your help @James. :D



    T
     
    whatever_gong82 likes this.
  10. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    The 3D movie finally arrived yesterday.


    I played it in my UHD player in 2D without a hitch. No adjustments needed.

    I tried the disc in my PC and surprisingly, PDVD played it just fine in 2D without turning on AnyDVD's "Simulate connected 3D display"...

    I suppose PDVD has its own "3D-to-2D" converter.

    All was good so I made a protected .iso backup of the disc, which also played perfectly in PDVD (and also without AnyDVD simulation).


    This is a 2-hour music concert and it looks stunning in 1080p. I needn't have worried that the 2D conversion would look wonky(lol).

    In fact, this concert looks and sound so good, it's up there in my Top 20 list.


    So, I decided I should make a disc backup to augment the HD backup.

    And that's where the trouble started!


    Mounting the protected .iso and setting ImgBurn up to copy the folders in the virtual drive to a disc, it complained that I would need 82G free on the disc. The .iso is only 40G!

    I figure this had something to do with 3D (somehow), so I processed the .iso in CloneBD, hoping it would strip out "the 3D parts".

    Made a full copy folder, no compression.

    However, this folder came out as 28G. Go figure!

    Had no idea what was going on but for grins, I decided to "gently" compress the .iso in CloneBD and burn to a 25G disc. It worked!!


    I really don't like compression, gentle or otherwise, so afterward I thought of a way to make a full disc backup that would be 40G.

    I created an unprotected .iso from the original disc. Then used Imgburn to burn the .iso directly to the backup disc.

    That seems to be working!

    There was also the added benefit of creating the unprotected .iso with AnyDVD's "Remove sequence shorter than.." set high enough to get rid of some annoying clips that appear before getting to the Main Menu.



    I'm not really sure what's up with all the different sizes generated.

    As soon as the 40G burn is complete will compare it to the 25G backup to see if there are visible (or audible) differences.




    T
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2019
  11. Ch3vr0n

    Ch3vr0n Translator NL & Mod

    CloneBD currently can't handle BD3D disc to disc backups while maintaining 3D. It only works at the moment when converting to 2D, i did reach out to a contact at Elby myself a while ago and 3D support is low on the to-do list for disc-to-disc. With the rise of UHD, 3D releases seem to have decreased dramatically, and with it the "urgency" to add 3D disc to disc support.
     
  12. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    Ok!! I guess that explains the reduction to 28G when using CloneBD. (it was actually .iso-to-folder but that probably doesn't make a difference)

    But why do you think ImgBurn wanted 82G for the burn of the protected .iso folders and insisted on BD-R XL to be used?

    Is there something in the disc that makes it double the volume because there's left-eye and right-eye video?

    Just a guess....


    Makes perfect sense and I don't blame them.

    I'm sure UHD will completely surplant 3D very soon.


    Never been a fan of 3D, but now that I know AnyDVD and my UHD player can handle them in 2D, trying to get things you cannot find on 2D -- before 3D disappears altogether.

    Also would like to compare a 2D movie to its equivalent in 3D converted to 2D.

    See if there's a benefit with 3D to 2D...


    T
     
  13. Ch3vr0n

    Ch3vr0n Translator NL & Mod

    You'd have to as LUK over at imgburn forums, but i think it has something to do with the fact that IMGBurn can't handle protected content, any better than CLBD can.
     
  14. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    Ok, I think I will do that.

    Actually never been on the ImgBurn forum.


    The content ImgBurn sees is not protected though. If it was, ImgBurn would move it but the output would be unplayable.

    As long as you take a protected .iso and mount it with AnyDVD running, then copy the folders in the virtual drive to another destination (using ImgBurn or anything else), the content is unprotected for all intents-and-purposes.

    Of course if the .iso is unprotected, you can just move the .iso itself in ImgBurn.

    And that's why I was able to create the 40G disc, ImgBurn simply moved the unprotected image to disc instead of analyzing and interpreting it.

    'Cause when it analyzes something goes wrong and it thinks it's looking at 82G data.


    Maybe LUK can clue me in as to what goes wrong...




    T
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2019
  15. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    After reviewing both the 25G and 40G backup discs, I found they both play well and look great in 2D.

    To my eyes, the 40G has more visual dynamic range, but it's an incremental improvement.

    Still, I somehow got more engulfed in watching the 40G disc.


    So, I learned something new about handling 3D discs in the process and made 2 disc backups for this 3D concert to boot.

    :)


    T
     
  16. mbarnstijn

    mbarnstijn Well-Known Member

    Somewhere on these forums is an explanation of the 3D ISO expansion in size in more detail, but there is a short answer. The encoding for 3D is intended to be backward compatible to 2D on older 2D-only Blu-ray players (even though most 3D discs are 3=layer and the oldest players can't handle the extra layer). There's a set of 2D stream files, and a set of 3D stream files that have the extra video encoding to give the left/right video. The 2D and 3D stream files SHARE SECTORS on the disc. Yes, you read that right, the file structure is deliberately interwoven at the sector level. So a file-by-file copy of the disc structure can get much larger than the physical sector size of the original disc.
     
    testiles likes this.
  17. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    Wow. Is that what it is?

    Thanks Michael for that enlightening explanation!

    Totally clears up why the ImgBurn "file-by-file" copy blew up volume by a factor of 2.

    And as I said before, the image copy worked because ImgBurn just dumped the image to the disc without analyzing it's components or attempting a file-by-file copy.


    Cool, guy.


    T
     
  18. Ch3vr0n

    Ch3vr0n Translator NL & Mod

    He's referring to the SSIF folder/files in the bdmv directory. Those are virtual references for the right eye and don't actually exist on the disc. A drive doesn't know if they're virtual or real, so when you rip to folders the drive creates actual files, doubling or tripling the disc size. Which is why the sticky above states that 3D discs MUST BE ripped to iso at all times. That creates a disc image and keeps the virtual files virtual.

    Verstuurd vanaf mijn Nexus 6P met Tapatalk
     
  19. testiles

    testiles Well-Known Member

    Ok, gotcha!

    I did see the SSIF folder within STREAM on the disc. Had never seen it in other Blu-Rays and was wondering what was its purpose.


    Right, so always do 3D disc backups with AnyDVD's "Rip to Image".

    And I would just add, if you're going to burn a backup disc from the image and you're using ImgBurn, make sure you've created an unprotected .iso and use ImgBurn's "Write Image File to disc" -- for the same reasons.


    Thanks Ch3vron.

    File this under "Mystery Solved".



    T
     
  20. Yarc

    Yarc Well-Known Member

    I remember I post a while back from a member of the team saying 3D was being worked on in parallel with other updates. I mistakenly took that to mean we would be getting this feature at some point in the near future, but this now seems uncertain. The post was probably over a year ago now, I've lost track of time and life events have taken priority. I do understand that 3D is not in big demand - no new TV's have 3D support - and it makes sense for the team to work on the features that are in demand to attract customers, but it's still disappointing. I hope 3D is not removed from the list of features.